Armory consolidation a marriage of practicality and survival.

by Guest Blogger on March 13, 2013 · 53 comments

This guest post by Anthony M and entry in our non-fiction writing contest.

I  know what everyone is thinking.  Oh great, another gun nut.

Well  I am a gun nut, but I do not have an entire vault full of every weapon  ever used in a war.  I do not collect them just to show them off.  I  am not a person who buys $3,000 dollar firearms just because it is “the best” and I do not have a “complex” where everything  I own has to be the largest.

What I am is an average Joe who wants the most bang for his buck,  literally.

I  used to have firearms of many calibers and thought I was prepared for  whatever task may be needed from a “boom stick”.  But as the  preparedness life style started creeping into the back of my mind I  started to look at things differently.  I started getting sick  of having to stock 6-8 different calibers and then having to select  what firearm to use whenever I went out.  With much deliberation  and a few tears I decided to limit my arsenal and stock up on the essentials.   But what are the essentials, you ask?

Well, the idea came to me when I was reading about cowboys and the  old west and how they used to carry a rifle and pistol in the same caliber.   The cowboys, who ultimately lived the bug out lifestyles, having everything  they owned on their back (or their horse’s) and making do with what  they had, are what some of our plans are for a SHTF situation.   My SHTF scenario is not to run off into the woods.  But, on my  way to my BOL I may not be able to use a vehicle which would force me  to go on foot.  The reasons that I would be on foot could be a  solar flare, EMP, road blocks, or break down.  I’m sure you could  think of a few more reasons why you would be on foot.  Having a  long gun and pistol of the same caliber makes my load lighter and easier  to carry.  Taking this one step further, to make my pack simpler  would be to use the same magazines and same parts for my long rifle  and pistol.

 

The  benefits of having your pistol and long rifle share ammunition and parts:

    1. Same ammunition
    2. Same platform for muscle memory
    3. Same magazines so no confusion when in a firefight   or a hurry
    4. Less extra parts need to be carried for repairs
    5. Common parts between team members
    6. Lighter and smaller pack to carry

The first step was to assess my collection and do some research on  velocities of handgun calibers.  I found the caliber that I liked  and decide to stick with it.  For me that was the .45 acp, mostly  because I already owned a few 1911s, liked the simplicity of the 1911,  and I liked the muzzle energy of the 45 acp out of a 16 inch barrel.

NOTE: There are many other fine calibers to choose from.  The  .410 ga./45LC, 9mm, .40 cal, 22 mag, .357/.38 spl, and many others just  to name a few.

Then the hard part started.  I needed to cut down on my arsenal  to pay for my new toys.  Now, I do NOT condone selling firearms,  but since I was buying some to replace them I figured it was acceptable  as long as I did not tell anyone.  Mostly for fear that they would  think I was really going off the deep end.

NOTE: There is no need to sell your firearms to pay for new ones.   But it was the right thing to do in my situation.

First  I had to decide which ones I would absolutely NEVER give up.

  • 1. Heirlooms  that were handed down to me and I intended to hand down
  • 2. My  go to guns such as hunting shotgun, carry pistols, and rifles
  • 3. My  first gun that I bought
  • 4.   Hand out weapons for neighbors

This  left me with a nice combination of all around firearms that would suit  many purposes.

Then  I had to decide which ones I could part with.

  • 1. Expensive  special editions that I would never shoot
  • 2. Odd  ball calibers that I never shoot (or can’t afford to shoot)
  • 3. Unreliable  guns that I do not trust nor would want any friends to use
  • 4. Guns  that were cool to have at the time but have since lost their appeal

Once  the sales were completed I needed to turn the money into steel.

NOTE:  I used my local gun shop to sell them on Gunbroker.com.  They only  charged a few percent and did all of the pictures, listings, and shipping  which was well worth it to me.

To finally decide what I was going to choose I had to do some research.   After some research I found the mech-tech systems, high point carbines,  marlin camp carbines, pistols with butt stocks, and many other carbine  systems.  All of these were great options and I was really close  to going with the mech-tech.  However, after seeing the price tags  on all of these I decided to build my own carbine.

NOTE: This is not an easy option and not for everyone, but I have  a good friend who is a machinist and we were looking for a project to  do.

I bought a 16 inch barrel for my 1911 and built a butt stock for it.   I put a fore grip on it, a 120 lumen light, and nice iron sights which  rounds this off to my perfect long gun.  It has the reliability  of the 1911, the accuracy of a rifle (to a certain range), the same  parts as my side arm, and is very light.

NOTE: The butt stock is a prototype and we are currently designing  new ones.  It looks rough but is completely functional and sturdy.

picture 1 300x225 Armory consolidation a marriage of practicality and survival.

My main 1911s and 15 round magazines.
Concealable ATI 3.2 inch barrel stainless steel
5 inch 1927 Argentine colt
2011 single stack RIA with Picatinny rail, 16 inch barrel, and butt stock
(Not pictured-5” RIA that is completely interchangeable with the carbine RIA)

I am not telling everyone that this is the only way to have a sidearm/carbine  combo that is interchangeable. There are many firearm conversion kits  out there that people should look at and I suggest some searching to  find the right combination for you.

Below  is a picture of my firearm grab bag.  Just an idea of how much  smaller your load can be without having to pack two different rounds  or magazines.

picture2 300x225 Armory consolidation a marriage of practicality and survival.

Grab Bag (old tool bag from garage sale)
Carbine is usually collapsed so only the barrel is sticking out of the bag
Magazines loaded and easily accessible (~90 rnds)
2 boxes of ammo (100 rnds) on inside (white box on left side)
Cleaning kit attached to handle (top of picture)
Extra batteries, goggles, hearing protection, holster, spare parts, and
simple take down tools also inside.
(Extra ammo in all vehicles and GHBs)

So, now I have a pistol and firearm that share everything in common  and cover quick draw (pistol), close range (pistol/carbine), and long  range rifle fire (carbine).  One reason that I do not want to carry  around an AK or AR or other long range rifle is because I do not foresee  myself having to fire over 200 yards and this does not justify the extra  weight.  My reasoning for keeping my shots under 200 yards is due to  a limit of my abilities, moral grounds for shooting that far at an animal  or person, and if I am that far away I should either leave or move closer.   How many of you could make the 200-500 yard shot that many of your rifles  are capable of?

My next problem was how much ammunition to store?  I contemplated  this a lot and finally came up with my stock up number, but I will leave  this number up to you to decide.

NOTE: I am not giving you a number because it will be different for  everyone.

Some  options that I thought of that may help you decide on a stock up number:

  • 1. How much ammo active duty personnel carry on  a patrol and multiply that by projected duration of SHTF.
  • 2. How  much ammo is recommended for an active forward operating base
  • 3. Look  up statistics for how much ammunition is used in an average firefight
  • 4. Look  at the route to your bug out location and find the entire population  between your location and your destination.  Then you could do  some arithmetic, multiply the population by 2 (double tap), or some  other method to figure out a number.
  • 5.  Look at availability of your decided upon round in a SHTF. Does LE,  military, militias, or local ammo selling points carry your ammo?

My next problem that I encountered was when I started thinking about  my neighbors.  I realized none of my neighbors even had firearms and  if they did they were not reliable.  I figured I may need some  help defending my local area or getting to my bug out location in a  SHTF.

NOTE: I am only counting my neighbors who have earned my trust and  will be beneficial to my safety in a SHTF.

This  lack of firearms meant I had to figure out what to get for hand out  weapons.

I figured out that the most common weapon that my neighbors have is  the 12 gauge.  Also for the neighbors who did not have experience  with firearms the 12 ga. would be the easiest to learn.  I had  to choose a platform so that all of my hand outs were the same for simplicity.   I decided to go with the Mossberg 500.  Some of you may be skeptical  of the Mossberg but it has been used and trusted in the military, law  enforcement and by hunters for many years.  I have used it hunting  for years and have never had a problem.  I trust it and knew that  I could get them rather cheap at my local gun shop.  I was able  to pick up a couple Mossberg 500s really cheap (cheaper than mosin nagants)  and am keeping them as hand out weapons.  I hear many people talk  about the mosin nagant and how you can get them and a lot of ammo for  cheap.  My issues with the mosin nagant are; who knows how to disassemble  one, I do not trust them, and where am I going to get ammo for them  in a long term situation?  The advantages to me in using the Mossberg  500 is because they are reliable, tear down easily, easy to operate,  and use one of the most popular rounds in the U.S.

NOTE: There are many other shotguns that would fulfill this role such  as the Remington 870, Winchester 1300, or a variety of other trusted  shotguns.

 

picture3 300x225 Armory consolidation a marriage of practicality and survival.

Some of my Mossbergs:
Top one is my go to with side saddle, 3-point sling, and smooth slug barrel
Bottom two are nice guns with longer smooth barrels.
50 round bandoliers. (2 for $17 at sportsmanguide.com)

Another reason I went with the 12 gauge is for the versatility of  the round.  The 12 ga. round should have its own article but I  will just cover some of the basics.  I can use slugs for 150 yards  and under, buck shot for out to 50 yards reliably, and cheap birdshot  for practice, hunting small game, or indoor defense.  There are  also the novelty rounds such as flares, flechette, dragons breath, grenade  rounds (rare and expensive), and short shells.  The short shells  should have their own topic also, but I just wanted to cover them quickly,  I like short shells because they add capacity to your magazine and have  the same knock down power at close range (usually same powder less pellets)  as normal shells.  There are different sizes such as 1-3/4 inch  or 2 inch.  They can jam easily so make sure you test them before relying  on them.

NOTE: The 1-3/4 is only recommended for the Winchester 1300 by the  manufacturer but can be reliable in other shotguns if some simple modifications  are done.  The 2 inch is generally reliable in most pumps.

It is also easy to get inserts for the 12 gauge that will fire just  about any other round on the market.  These inserts look like a  12 gauge shell with a hole in the back.  You can put another (smaller)  round into the hole and the firing pin from the shotgun will fire the  smaller round.  Your weapon might be a single shot with these but  it adds a lot of versatility, especially in a shortage of ammunition.

Do  some soul searching and duckduckgoing and try to come up with a good  plan.

  • There  is a plethora of hand gun caliber carbines out there and I wanted to  list some that may spark some interest:
  • 1. Grease gun
  • 2. Sten gun
  • 3. Mech-tech
  • 4. Glock butt stock adapter and 16 inch barrel
  • 5. High point carbines
  • 6. Many cowboy gun combinations
  • 7. The judge and Rossi circuit judge
  • 8. 1911 butt stock and 16 inch barrel
  • 9.  AR uppers that accept other ammunition

NOTE: I would like to bring up the Judge pistols and the Rossi Circuit  Judge.  They are a 45 Long Colt and .410 gauge combination revolvers  that can be bought in a pistol version or carbine version.  You  can read up on .410s and 45 LC rounds and make your own conclusions  but I would trust a .410 to take down a deer so I’m pretty sure it  would work for two legged varmint.  You could also get adapters  similar to the 12 ga. to fire just about any caliber out of the revolver  judge and make it very versatile.  I would highly recommend the  Judge family to anyone who is just starting out in firearms.  Make  sure you get some adapters to shoot 22s out of it to start out and ease  into the larger calibers.

After all of this running around and putting my ideas into action  I only need to know two gun systems and I only need to store 2 types  of rounds.  45 ACP and 12 gauge.

The reason for this article is not to sell you on buying a bunch of  1911’s and Mossberg 500s.  The reason is to get you thinking  about simplifying your arsenal so you can simplify your life. Nothing  in this article is an endorsement for any products or services mentioned.

Thank  you for reading and I look forward to discussing your opinions in the  comments below. Please  let me know if you disagree or have a different opinion than me because  the whole pack will benefit from having more than one option to think  about.

This contest will end on April 22 2013  – prizes include:

Well what are you waiting for – email your entries today. But please read the rules that are listed below first…  Armory consolidation a marriage of practicality and survival.

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53 comments… read them below or add one

jaxun March 13, 2013 at 10:51 am

Thanks for putting your thoughts to paper.

My own conclusion about how to build up an “armory” was based on the cost and availability of ammunition (as well as the initial investment cost and availability of weapons that fire them), so I am evaluating weapons that use the 22LR ammunition. Of course, not long after deciding this was the way I would go, ammo started disappearing off the shelf, and reappearing for brief times at a significantly higher price, so I’m not sure my initial conclusion still holds.

My first HD weapon purchase, ever, is the H&R Pardner Pump Protector, which is awaiting pickup from the local Big 5 after the 22nd this month. As someone who has never owned a firearm, it gives me an unfamiliar and not altogether “comfortable” sense of security knowing I will have the means to stop an intruder in our home if I ever face one.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 1:25 pm

There are many pistols and rifles that have conversion kits available for them. One option would be to find a pistol or rifle that you like and then get a conversion kit for it. You can use 22 for training or defense but still have the option to fire larger caliber rounds(for hunting or defense). Sometimes the conversions cost as much as a second firearm so there are many options to weigh. Have you looked into a larger caliber revolver and then use 22 inserts. For someone who is not as comfortable with firearms a revolver removes a lot of moving parts and confusion.

what ever firearm you choose i would suggest looking up classes at your local range that will make you familiar and more confident with your firearm.
Thanks for the comment.

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Big B March 13, 2013 at 6:39 pm

jaxun go with a nice 45 ACP hand gun like AM article explains, maybe a 1911 variant or a smith and wesson m&p model, 45 ammo is still obtainable and not too pricey as 556 and 308 for the rifles, this will definately stop and intruder, consider the 12ga shotgun is a good choice and if you are not completely comfortable take it to the range and get some training. gun owners will teach you and are suprisingly more approachable than we are made out to be.

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axelsteve March 13, 2013 at 11:03 am

I speed read the article since I need to get ready for work. I like the article since it does not promote a certian caliber or make,I get so tired of the in my 25 years experience in the police dept or army.Nothing against them I am just tire of the you need a ar 15 and a 9mm or you are toast.Burnt toast. I agree with the oddbal calibers and I like the fact about keeping family heirlooms for sentamental reasons. No reason to give up a 280 Ackly improved since it does not fit in a ar platform.Or the ol winchester 25 .20. thank you for the sound reasoning and I will re read it this evening.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 1:29 pm

Thanks for the comment. I did not want to tell people what to do. Just give them options. Also training, which I did not cover much in the paper, may be the most important factor in self defense. If you have a desert eagle but never train or practice you are not as prepared as if you have a 22 derringer and train and practice regularily. I would choose the person with the training and the smaller firearm. Shot placement is key.

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Big B March 13, 2013 at 6:34 pm

good point, the rambling is a characteristic of most of us Vets but for the average guy looking to secure his family and large caliber hand gun or magazine fed rifle will do the trick, i know a lot of OEF guys who are getting AK variants and other european weapons systems. so what ever your fancy AM is writing about the interoperability of ammo and weapons- mulitplied by the user friendly – un prepped ration – friends family neighbors, here is a 12 ga you dont have to teach them how to break down a mosin nagant bolt or a piston driven Stag arms AR – just point and shoot, plus it is cheaper for group buys. I like the buttstock for the 1911 and am getting one for the glock 22, ebay is a good source for unsual stablizing systems for handguns, in all I take this report as a good one, I am prepping some unititiated and they will duplicate wpns ammo and accessories for quick response, group buys and unit cohesion.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 9:50 pm

Big B,
Don’t forget the 16 inch barrel also to go with your stabalizer. Group uniformity (using the same weapon) is crucial and should be stressed. It will decrese confusion when handing around weapons and increase adaptability and ammo and mag availability. But we also want to make sure we aren’t forgetting to learn other systems just in case we are forced to something we aren’t comfortable with. There are so many things to consider.

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Ryan March 13, 2013 at 2:01 pm

Good thoughts Anthony… we seem to think very much alike. I have been thinking about keeping limited arsenal also. I have only 4 calibers to stock.. and I feel that is a reasonable quantity. Excellent food for thought… I especially like the idea of outfitting a .45 ACP to be used as a longer range weapon…. I was just looking at one the other day… I am likely going to grab that up after reading this article. Good stuff indeed.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 2:31 pm

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/45auto.html

Here is a very good website that covers a lot of ammo and compares the velocities of ammunition coming out of different length barrels. I am not affiliated with this website at all. If you look at the 45 acp barrel lengths the best length for velocity and knock down power is 16-17 inches. 9mm is about 14-16inches and 40 is 17 in and over. this website has A LOT of information. Let everyone know the carbine you are looking at getting.

anthony

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Thomas T. Tinker March 13, 2013 at 7:09 pm

Thank You for the link….. It helps decide on the carbine specs. I have in the works ahora.

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Tinfoil Hat March 13, 2013 at 2:04 pm

Great Article Anthony! Well organized, thought out, and enumerated. Now, at some point some clown is going to post something under the guise of “constructive criticism”, that is actually nothing more than them trying to commandeer the discussion and make them seat more knowledgable than you. Following this will come the nit picker who will fine tooth comb your article looking for ANY unimportant and/or completely irrelevant minutiae that they can “correct” under the guise of “not providing misinformation”, but again is an effort to appear smarter. Incidentally, the folks who post this will NOT be regular contributors to the blog.

Do yourself and your readers a favor, and ignore them. Thank you for writing an outstanding and informative article.

And for the folks who remember me…I’m still alive :)

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 2:34 pm

Thank you. It took a lot of rough drafts to get to the final draft. I tried to keep it short but did not succeed very well. there are so many different opinions to consider out there but I agree that a lot of peoples “approach” at sharing their opinions detracts from the knowledge. no one listens very well after they are called stupid. I will disregard any nay sayers. and i appreciate actual constructive criticism. NOT criticism.

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Rider of Rohan March 14, 2013 at 4:30 pm

Alive and well in Kentucky, lol. Don’t vote for that clown Ashley Judd if she runs for Senate is all I ask, and I’ll shut up on the gun article. Hahaha. Glad to see you post.

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boone March 13, 2013 at 2:20 pm

Great ideas Anthony i hadnt really thought of using the same caliber, i think i will switch out my AR for my kel tec sub 2000 in 9mm so i can be compatable with my glock 17 that will cut down on carring 2 calibers of ammo and mags. Great ideas.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 2:52 pm

I’m glad i got you thinking about alternatives. How do you like your kel tec sub 2000? Have you thought about doing a review on it?

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Big B March 13, 2013 at 6:19 pm

Boone, I’d keep that AR for good measure, while you may not have to stockpile 223/556 it is one of the most popular rounds/mags and weapons systems. and contrary to civilian belief you can reach out a touch at 500 yrd line with iron sights. if the shtf you can also obtain ammo and parts it off of the rogue LE who will assuradly use their badges and uniforms to try to disarm and steal chow from the prepped.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 9:55 pm

I agree that keeping the AR is important. And for your in home defense you will be able to choose your firearm as you would choose a golf club out of a bag for the multiple roles that you could need from one. But if you are trying to move lightly and quietly through the woods to get to a destination you would choose a different weapon than if you were going to be defending your property from armored personnel.

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jaxun March 13, 2013 at 7:51 pm

This is why I keep coming back to this site: great suggestions and insight. Just checked out a couple vids and reviews on the Keltec, and the pricing is right in my range.

Thanks!

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sadaddy March 13, 2013 at 2:43 pm

Good article! After the current run on ammo, I am rethinking my caliber selections. Always thought and heard “buy common calibers, get something chambered in a nato cartridge etc”. But try and find 9mm or .556 or .308 right now…not sure uber common is the best way anymore. Best to analyze and decide yourself. Good job!

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 3:30 pm

we must take a lot of things into consideration when prepping and storing. But my question about the “use what NATO uses” theory is… aren’t we prepping so we don’t have to go scavenging off of the UN and .gov? If someone wanted to use only 7mm and stored up a few thousand rounds. wouldn’t they be better off than someone who has a .223 and only has 200 rounds? so does it come down to the caliber selection or the stock up amount? we don’t all buy only MREs because that is what the .gov uses. we rely on ourselves. If you are only buying a few boxes of different calibers then you can not get the price breaks that you could get if you buy large amounts of one caliber.

I am not on the hunt for ammo but I hear from friends that .17HMR and 30-30 and other oddball hunting calibers are everywhere but common calibers are gone. maybe if someone is starting out maybe the odd ball is the way to go. When I was stocking up I was getting common calibers for good prices.

Thanks for the comment

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Big B March 13, 2013 at 6:24 pm

Good Point AM,

MRE’s for you non vets are a last resort chow option, you will eat and not got number 2 for a week and then when you do, you better have a box of baby wipes. try not to prep off whats so popular or what gov and military use, but what you can afford. with prices starting to even out (still high) its good to prep what you have, so for example if you AR platform is a standard training weapon so when i left the Corps I got one (semper) and the ammo i got doubled in value. but i am trained to use the system and knew prices would peak, bottom line if you have a bolt action mauser stock that rifle with as much as you can.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 9:15 pm

Hello Big B,

Semper Fi,
“box of baby wipes” haha thank you for the laugh.
you bring up two great points. Train with what you have and stock up for what you have. Do not rely on luck or others charity.

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axelsteve March 14, 2013 at 12:58 am

I can buy 308 all day long in my area. Only 50 bucks a box.

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anthony m March 14, 2013 at 8:59 am

22 LR was “on sale” at gander for $150 for 500 and $20 for 50.
it wasn’t the expensive stuff either and it didn’t stay on the shelf long.

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Tactical G-Ma March 13, 2013 at 5:53 pm

Good article, Anthony. In fact one of the best I have read recently on how to and why regarding armory. Thanks for your contribution.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 6:12 pm

Thank you Tactical G-Ma,
I appreciate all of your contributions that you make to this blog. I have followed this site for a long time and always appreciate your down to earth view.
If you have any questions or input feel free to share.

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Uncle Charlie March 13, 2013 at 6:38 pm

I am also a gun nut and most of my purchases have been used but I have several NIBs, very fine hunters but nothing outrageously expensive. I also have a lot of of odd ball calibers in Mauser’s, Carcano’s, Mosin-Nagants and Enfield’s along with some .250-3000 and .300 Savage as well, not to mention of bunch of lever guns in various calibers. I have not been able to let go yet as most of these were not purchased for teotwawki but would be fine for that purpose. I am not mechanically inclined like you are so I went with the Hi-Point carbines in mostly 9mm but also .40 S&W and .45ACP along with the corresponding handguns. They have all been extremely reliable despite the bad rep of the handguns. I have no “black guns” although I have several SKS rifles (mostly Yugo’s). I recently purchased a used Circuit Judge (.410/45LC) which is a lot of fun to shoot but would be not be one of my go to guns in case of emergencies. I have a couple of Saiga shotguns in .410 and .20 GA for my DIL and son, but I keep a 8 shot Maverick pump shotgun (a poor man’s Mossberg 500) for myself. I am hoping to pass these down to my son and grandchildren so I will not be selling them unless I get desperate. I have very little ammo for most of these but have stocked up on the cheap and useful calibers: 22LR; 9mm; 40 S&W; 5.45×39; 7.62×39; 7.62x65R and some British 303 I lucked into at a good price.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 9:22 pm

Hello,
Quite the collection there. I am not advocating people must sell their collections, I understand it is a life style and hobby and investment and I do not want to interfere. I am glad that you have many combos that will be easy to transport and carry that are interchangeable. The maverick is a very reliable firearm that I would not hesitate to trust. I especially like the 8 shot addition to it. Glad you have stocked up on ammo. What good is having a lot of firearms in the safe if you have no ammo to shoot. Some of those would make good clubs I suppose:)
Even with just this little shortage of ammo many people that I know do not have enough ammo for going to the range and are forced to fight for ammo and are limited to one to two boxes at a time. I have been slowly introducing “stocking up” to beat inflation to them. I have even been sharing canned good coupons with the neighbors in hopes that they will start to buy some more also. Sorry got off topic.haha

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Thomas T. Tinker March 13, 2013 at 7:34 pm

OouRah for U AM… I have a safe load of ‘Queens’ that never…. never see the daylight of the range. I had decided to look into ‘partner’ guns, especially in 9mm and 38/357. For me… Just Me…. Adco Arms is building a ‘GlockAR-9mm’ for me. The upper arrived just last Friday and the lower parts should be in this week. The lower will accept any sized Glock Mag and I have been picking up the 31 rounders for months now. I Own and use all.. the G series 9mm and practice constantly and run IDPA and IPSIC each season with them. #2.. Ruger 38/357 speed six and SP-101s.. and have had noluckatall finding a Marlin or Rossi lever action to pair up. Everything else…. is all good but limited to only two other rifle cal. and of course…… 22.

Your post is another outstanding reminder of why I haunt this blog and another outstanding piece of work…… and Gawd bless you for bring up the loaner/charity shotguns. Now I know there is at least one other nutcase out there. I added 22 rifles to that as long as I can find em $100 or less…………..

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 9:00 pm

Hello TTT,
Thank you for the post. Everyone is making my head swell with all of the praise.
The glockAR will be very nice. I do like all of the different uppers that are available for the AR. 410 all the way up to .50 BMG!!!! the 50 is not fed through the “normal” mag well though.haha
good luck on the marlin and rossi lever actions. they will be nice to have.
I feel the loner weapons are very important. We can not all be surrounded by perpared folk but as long as we are surrounded by people we TRUST it is almost as good.

Thank you for all of the comments and articles you post. I really appreciate everything that you contribute.

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JSW March 13, 2013 at 8:41 pm

Note: “…sizes such as 1-3/4 inch or 2 inch…”

I think you mean 2 3/4 or 3 inch. But that’s just me. There is an old 2 1/2 inch for genuine cowboy era guns.

It’s always refreshing to find someone who thinks along similar lines as oneself. Dunno how long I’ve been preaching commonality of caliber for BugOut or GetMeHome guns, and still think it’s a great idea. (Those old time survivalists weren’t so dumb, after all.)

I’m sticking with the .357′s- a locker full of them in rifle and pistol configuration- though once considered a SUB2000 in 9mm (Honey wanted the .40). I still think it’d be a good cobination, though a bit wimpy in either caliber for beyond a hundred yards. And the .45 auto is barely, IMO, useful any farther. I’d go with the cowboy caliber .45s for some real punch and range.

Tinker- where are you looking for your .357 rifles? Since the shelves were bared of ‘evil black rifles’, there’s been an influx of lever actions in this area (MN), so maybe it’ll happen in your area as well. I’ve shot the Marlin ’94C a few years, love it (and it shows in the bluing and wood’s staining) and recently bought the Taurus-Rossi and like it as well. Actually, kind of like it better than the Marlin ‘cuz it’s lighter and seems faster. Plus, it’s a Winchester action, though will be hard to scope it has mount holes drilled and tapped for a ‘scout style’ scope under the rear sight.

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Thomas T. Tinker March 14, 2013 at 10:00 am

JSW: I’m in NW Ohio. I haven’t seen on on anyones shelf or at the show here in town…. last week end…. I dont’ know that I’d drive to MN but MI, Ind, Ky, Wv, sure! There is something about the Rossi. Not quite the ‘chunk’ the Marlin is. I would like to stay domestic with the rifle. I know how hype-o-critical that is knowing the line of Austrian Tupperiron I own. I’ve said it before… I’ve found a set of shoes that fit me perfectly….

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JSW March 13, 2013 at 8:50 pm

P.S. to above: having only one caliber lightens the load considerably by requiring only one reloading press and set of dies and comonality of powder and bullet in rifle and pistol loads makes it simple to remember what you’re using where.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 9:11 pm

Hello JSW,
-The centurion 1 and 3/4 and 2 inch mini shells. They are fairly common in some stores. I hope I made it clear to everyone what length I was talking about. I also hope I made it clear to check if they are reliable in your firearm.
-Yes they were smarter than the average bear.
-There are many calibers that a person could use for a carbine and many of them will work just fine.
-I also live in MN and have seen quite a few “cowboy” guns moving to the front of the store to fill the vacuum left by the “assault weapons” leaving so fast.
- I hope that JSW or Uncle Charlie writes a review on the circuit judge. I have handle one many times in the store but haven’t “pulled the trigger” on the purchase yet.
-I did not touch on reloading in the article even though I should have. Thank you for reminding everyone about that very important aspect of how limiting the number of calibers will make reloading much cheaper and easier.

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j.r. guerra in s. tx. March 16, 2013 at 10:26 pm

Aquila sells (or used to) sell 12 gauge mini-shells, but the sales person told me that she didn’t recommend them for pump or (especially) autoloading actions. I was interested in them for a single shot break open shotgun anyway for BOB use (way more compact – 4 minis = 3 full size), but appreciated the honesty. As Anthony M stated above – CHECK to see if they feed reliably,

Also will add – air rifles for vermin eradication make sense. Ammunition is easily found for far less money than even rimfire ammo.

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JP in MT March 13, 2013 at 9:19 pm

My GHB has a 357 revolver and a 357 trapper carbine. That may be supplemented with a light weight 22 LR semi-auto pistol with a can. Works for me.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 9:28 pm

Seems like a plan. Why carry the 22 pistol also?

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JP in MT March 13, 2013 at 9:33 pm

anthony m:

Because sometimes “silence is golden”.

This includes something I might need to eat or something that is between me and where I’m going, and going around is not an option.

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 9:57 pm

understood and what I figured. How quiet could you make the carbine?? reduced powder reloads? use a “can” on the carbine? would these help lighten your load?

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Gary in Bama March 13, 2013 at 9:24 pm

How can you write an artical on firearms with out worshiping the mighty AR15 !!!??? ok enuff sarcasm.great post i never thought about inserts for my judge. Lot of great ideas thank you

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 9:30 pm

Gary,
I was kind of worried there for a moment. Glad I could stir up a new idea for someone. The inserts are rather expensive. If you have a machinist friend I would explain your problem to him and he may be able to make some for you. Just an idea.

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Anothermom March 13, 2013 at 10:51 pm

Wonderful thought, but, since I live in New York, I don’t think any of the residents here can afford to dispose of any of their guns a this time, even if it will “tidy up” their armory

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anthony m March 13, 2013 at 10:57 pm

You do not have to “tidy up” at all. I even do NOT recommend it if you can afford it. Just make sure your armory is functional for your needs and prep accordingly.
My heart goes out to those in NY. Everyone needs to communicate with their representatives in all states.

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Penny Pincher March 13, 2013 at 11:19 pm

I’ve been looking for a 9mm carbine. Might have to give up, there is such a gun shortage around here.

As for the ammo shortage, “I got mine” but I would like to burn some practicing. I have snap caps though. That and a change of batteries in the cat laser pointer, might allow me to practice enough at home without any bangs.

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anthony m March 14, 2013 at 9:06 am

have you looked into the pistol buttstocks that are for glocks and some other common pistols. It may be cheaper and easier to find than a carbine. Mech-tech makes a good system also. Not sure on what their status is for ordering.
http://www.armslist.com is a local “craigslist” type website that is for your area. you may have a good chance finding something on there. (I am not affiliated with armslist)
Practicing is always good. the fundamentals can still be practiced with out actually firing a shot. repetitive holster drawing is the same with or without shooting.

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Thomas T. Tinker March 14, 2013 at 10:07 am

Wouldn’t a clip/screw/glue on butt stock make anything sold as a pistol…. an NFA class weapon? I know the barrel length dosen’t matter….. on a pistol…(See ThompsonCenter) but adding a stock…..

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anthony m March 14, 2013 at 11:06 am

sorry I forgot to mention that you need a 16 inch barrel. You can make any pistol into a rifle but you can NOT make a rifle into a pistol. Some state will vary.

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Big B March 16, 2013 at 11:31 am

Telescoping Shoulder Stock for Glock check that on ebay all you glock owners who wish to create a stable carbine type platform, while some of us are not as technically proficient or have trustworthy machinists to fabricate them as AM’s 1911 build, these stocks are made in Isreal and they have some awesome accessories for Glocks and AR platforms,

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Sw't Tater March 13, 2013 at 11:30 pm

I liked the way you explained- your reasoning for your choices. Well written for those who are still making decisions and purchases.

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anthony m March 14, 2013 at 9:06 am

thank you very much. that is what I was going for.

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J Stuart March 14, 2013 at 9:30 am

I like the approach but would like to add that having a wider assortment of calibers in your collection gives you the flexibility of buying whatever caliber ammo you come across.

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Azyogi March 14, 2013 at 2:12 pm

I just stopped by a few LGS (local gun stores) and the wally world gun counter to check on reports of ammo shortage. I found plenty of the following 7.62 X 54R, 303 Brit, 7.65 Argentine, even a couple boxes of 7.7 Jap. Sometimes those ‘oddball’ calibers can pay unexpected dividends. A plus here comes from reloading 150 grain .311″ will fit all the above plus the 7.62 X 39. (the Argentine does better with .312″ will work) as for reloading the Lee field loader http://www.midwayusa.com/product/246418/lee-classic-loader-45-acp comes in most of these calibers. There were still primers and powder in most places that carry it, so a couple boxes of versatile Speer or Sierra bullets and $30 worth of tools in a box the size of a paperback book and I’m not fazed by temporary shortages.
Ps if you get a Lee field loader get a good mallet they make this much easier to work with.

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Rider of Rohan March 14, 2013 at 9:38 pm

You have some great ideas, thinking outside the box, and I like that. I also wouldn’t mind having a lever action rifle in .44 mag or .357 mag and carrying the corresponding sixguns like a S&W M-29 for instance. But these have gotten pricey lately. Nice article, anthony.

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