Bugging Out to the Boonies? Ten Ways to Keep Your Camp Clean

This guest post is by Estar H and entry in our non-fiction writing contest .

If you are prepping packs or vehicles to bug out, where are you planning to go? Will you seek refuge in a rural area, maybe even in the wilderness? Whether you retreat to a fully stocked off-the-grid hideaway, setup camp on private acreage, or wing it on public lands, everyone in your circle should be committed to keeping the area clean and safe. Your methods will vary according to location and duration.

This article focuses on activities related to eating. Thoughtfully managing the food cycle will deter pests, preserve the food supply, and help you keep a low profile. Failing to keep your area clean may wreak havoc in the camp,especially if you attract a bear. Then you could end up with a hole like the one in the accompanying photo in your camp.

When living in the wild there are no guarantees. But here are 10 things I do that usually work.

1. Pack all food in solid metal or plastic containers with tight-fitting lids.

Start collecting containers of various sizes and storing food in them now. When you arrive at your destination, stash these containers in a secure area. This could be a cabin, cellar, vehicle, cache box, or a sack hung high in a tree.

2. Don’t bring food in cardboard or paper containers.

It always amazes me when people bring sacks of sugar and flour to camp in the wilds. Such containers are easily chewed and clawed through. When they get wet you’ll have a mess on your hands. No boxes of crackers, mac and cheese, or cookies in paper wrappers. Your food won’t be safe in cellophane or Styrofoam either.

3. Leave plastic bags in civilization

Zip lock plastic bags can be washed out with soap and hot water and remain useful for a while. It’s nice that they’re waterproof, but they tend to retain food odors. They also fall apart. It’s better to bring containers that will last a long time. Besides, plastic is out-of-place in the wild.

4. Don’t bring sweet condiments into nature

You may yearn to satisfy your sweet tooth, but so do all sorts of critters, from ants and Yellow Jackets to bears. Bring dried fruits and berries in canisters. Leave sweet sauces, syrups, and condiments behind.Pack hard candy sparingly. Nobody wants to suffer through an extended emergency with cavities.

5. Clean up your food scraps

If you are fortunate to have any fresh fruits and vegetables there will be food scraps to deal with. If you are near a working compost pile,put your vegetable and fruit scraps there. It helps to cut them into small pieces. In a remote undeveloped area, rather than try to start a compost pile,the best bet is to bury those scraps a safe distance from camp.

Thoroughly dispose of meat and fish scraps, fats, and bones you don’t use. The most efficient way is to burn them. If you are trying to lay low, however, a fire will disclose your location. Rocket stoves are efficient and cause much less smoke, so check them out.

6. Clear your plate

Like mom’s of old said, “Clear your plate!”. Leftovers are a liability where there is no refrigerator or ice, and they will attract animals in the wilderness. Before you head for the hills, practice cooking only as much as can be consumed in one meal. Train everybody you plan to retreat with to clear their plates.

7. Washing the dishes

This is where you will be really glad to be camped near water. If you have fire, wash and rinse dishes in water that is as hot as you can bear. Items used closest to the mouth get washed and rinsed first, in descending order.

What about soap? You may be intending to bring a stash, then make some as time goes by. Some folks like to use baking soda instead.Bicarbonate of soda offers an advantage in that it is versatile. It addition to washing dishes, it can be used as an anti acid, tooth paste, foot powder, ant deterrent, and more.

For safety sake, assume all surface water contains something that can make you sick. It’s good to bring the water to a boil. This becomes a problem when fuel is scarce. Maybe you only have enough to boil the rinse water. If not, you will have to use cold water. Shake the excess off the dishes and, if there is sun, lay them in it to dry.

If you’re purifying potable water, decide whether you have enough to give implements destined for mouths a final rinse. Don’t worry so much about the pots and pans because high temperatures kill most pathogens. Rainwater is handy, but not ideal due to atmospheric pollution.

Did you bring food in tin cans? These will have to be washed out. Be really careful not to cut your fingers on the sharp edges. Take extra care with cans that contained fish because the strong odor will likely attract critters. Cleaning cans that contained fish packed in oil requires more hot water and soap than those canned in water. Fill used cans with water immediately so they can soak before getting crusty.

You may be tempted to flush waste away by simply discarding it into moving water. It’s not a healthy or aesthetic practice, especially if a lot of people are doing it.

8. Bury the garbage

Limit the amount of garbage you bring with you. For example,what will you do with the cans once they’re clean? They will either pile up or you will have to bury them. (This goes for all your trash). If you think you can bury cans without cleaning them, you’d better dig down at least a good three feet if your hole is near camp.

The picture accompanying this article was taken the morning after a bear visited one of my camps. Some leftovers a fellow camper had buried about a foot in the ground attracted the bear. The hole is about 18 inches down.

9. Managing the gray water

Gray water is what you get when you wash things, including yourself. During a shtf scenario, gray water may no longer be flushed away through pipes. You’re going to have to collect it and do something with it.

If you will be stationary for a season, you might plant seeds. If water is scarce, you may consider applying gray water to the plants.Check out the pros and cons at oasisdesign.net. Does your gray water contain little scraps of food or oils? Think about insects and animals that maybe attracted to it.

10. What goes down must come out

Your destination probably won’t include toilet facilities managed by authorities. Therefore, you will have to take responsibility for your own excrement.

A preplanned refuge should include a composting system or outhouse. If you are escaping in an RV, better not rely on its toilet in case the emergency doesn’t pass before the collection tank is full. The same goes for chemical camping toilets that will have to be emptied somewhere.

On undeveloped acreage, you will either have to relieve yourself in small holes that are covered after each use, or you might dig a latrine, which you may prefer when bad weather hits. A tarp can be strung over the pit to get out of the weather, and for privacy. In some cases, it may be practical to build a hut over the hole. Each deposit in the pit should also be covered after use. Ashes make an excellent covering that eliminates odor and flies. Just make sure any coals are cold. If your pit is at a temporary remote camp, fill it with dirt and restore ground cover before moving on.

If you flee to an undeveloped area in winter, with snow and frozen ground, hole digging will be severely limited. If you have a bonfire,burn things that will be completely consumed. Don’t leave half burned garbage lying around on the ground. When the fire is out, you may be able to dig there. If you have to store trash until spring, remove all food residues. Do everything in your power now to arrange for a safe and comfortable place to hole up, in case winter retreat becomes necessary.

Each person should consider it his or her responsibility to maintain a clean camp. Methods will vary according to location and circumstance. One thing is certain: strategies for keeping camp clean are a crucial part of any bug out plan.

This contest will end on August 7 2012 – prizes include:

First Place : 1 Year Subscription to AlertsUSA, 1 Radiation Safety Package consisting of the following;  (1) NukAlert Radiation Monitor and Alarm (5) Radsticker Peel and Stick Dosimeters (1) Box Thyro Safe Potassium Iodide. All courtesy of AlertsUSA. A $150 gift certificate for Federal Ammo courtesy of LuckyGunner Ammo. And a British Berkefeld water fillter system courtesy of  LPC Survival. A total prize value of over $700.

Second Place : A six pack Entrée Assortment courtesy of Augason Farms, a Nukalert courtesy of Shepherd Survival Supply and a WonderMill Grain Mill courtesy of Kitchen Kneads. A total prize value of over $550.

Third Place : A copy of each of my books “31 Days to Survival” and “Dirt Cheap Survival Retreat” courtesy of The Survivalist Blog dot Net and “Kelly McCann’s Inside the Crucible Set” courtesy of Paladin Press. A total prize value of over $200.

Contest ends on August 7 2012.

Comments

  1. Great post. The old adage “cleanliness is next to godliness” is apt. Being a mess in civilization with sewer, running water and garbage service is one thing. Being a mess in the camp can get you into a lot of trouble.

    Good tips and they are more important than many people realize.

  2. Good points .
    If a person is going to be at a location long enough to plant seeds as you suggest , then you should make a still . You can use your garbage to make alcohol for fuel . Using the so called ” green ” biodegradable soaps , shampoos ,dish soaps , etc . will make grey water less toxic , giving you more options . Pretend you just put in a septic tank and look for a leech pond area . Leave plastic behind ? why !!! almost everything is made of it these days , take what you need to to survive ………..nature is on her own at that point , and so are YOU . Burn trash ……..no big deal . Given the population of N.America , the wild is going to be invaded by all manner of people , few of which are going to be conservation minded if TSHTF , so why cut off your nose to spite your face ? Also , clear your plate is common sense , if your in that situation , your leftovers will most likely be very minimal to non existant , this is because your food supplies are limited , Storing leftovers will be problematic , if anything , you will be worried about having enough .

    • Thanks for the great suggestions. It never occurred to me to make a still to process kitchen scraps. RE: biodegradable soaps, I get my dish soap at the $1 store and use the gray water on my plants, which as always worked, I think given the more acidic soil PH in my area. I recently started using borax, which is good for plants in small amounts, something like a tablespoon to several gallons. I used a greater concentration to wash out some laundry and completely overdosed my poor seedlings. Well, it was an experiment. As for plastic, we had squatters on our property and I have been cleaning up their garbage for several years now. That plastic breaks down and when I try to pick it up it shatters into smaller pieces, but not small enough to be invisible. Grrr. Sore subject, I guess. Thanks for writing.

      • charlie (NC) says:

        Cotton Clothes washed with borax become somewhat flame retardant. Not really on topic. Just something I remembered that might help someone. Starch also helps. Ever notice what welders wear? Cotton! It is often starched to. If you see a welder wearing a starched, heavy cotton shirt and starched blue jeans or carharts it’s not because he wants to look sharp. It’s because sparks will roll off of the starched cotton instead of sticking and burning. The last thing you want to wear around welding or any sort of fire is polyester.

        • You hear the term ” cotton is rotten ” all the time , and perhaps true in some cases . I wear German Army flectarn BDU pants at work and when im outdoors , they are 65% cotton 35% man made , twill . These things are comfortable in 100+ degrees and wear like iron . German quality . I’ve worn the crappy stuff they give our troops ………….they tear just looking at them . Thanks for the tip about Borax . They do welding where I work as well .

    • Oh, as far as burning trash, I have to say, it is illegal to burn trash in the state where our off-grid camp is located. It is even illegal to burn paper plates here. Anybody want to guess where that is? There are neighbors nearby along the county road, and the wind often blows in that direction. Also, imo, it is not good to rely on burning trash. In a complete shtf scenario, the smoke will give away your location. When posted up before TEOTWAWKI, now for example, there are fire bans due to wildfire concerns. These two things are mainly what limits that option as a general practice.

      • Thats why in a lot of places you see trash by the side of the roads and other dumping ………..regulate people ability to run their own lives …….some will say ” screw you , then you can deal with it ” not sayin its right , but on the other hand …………

      • charlie (NC) says:

        It’s illegal to burn ANYTHING in this state (North Carolina) except yard debris less than 6″ in diameter and it has to be burned on the property where it fell. You can’t burn scrap wood, paper, trash,
        cardboard, plastic or anything except grass clippings and small limbs and branches. I believe that is Federal law but some states look the other way. The fine for burning plastic is (if I remember right) $500 per item. Meaning if you burn three 16 oz plastic soda bottles and 2 syrofoam coffee cups and the man finds the evidence you just spent $2500.00 plus court costs.

        With that said, a lot of folks still burn stuff here and if I needed to I might as well. It just pays not to get caught. Some of the air quality folks are real zealots. I happen to have one of those Nazis in my neighborhood. He writes farmers up for burning fertilizer bags in the field. Farmers have done that forever to keep the things from blowing all over creation. This guy will stop and write them up. He bragged to me once that he was on his way out of town on vacation, saw a farmer burning some bags, stopped and called his office on his cell phone and had them send someone out
        to write the farmer up.

        Now will that matter post shtf? Absolutely not. What you’ll have to worry about then is folks seeing or smelling your smoke.

        AS for making a still in a trash can to make alcohol for fuel, even if you can pull that off I don’t know any better way to attract a bear than having a trash can full of mash in my camp. Good luck with that. It would be a lot easier to fashion a crude gasifier than a still.

        • Out here , they thought it was a good idea to start charging people to take their trash to the dump ………then couldnt figure out why the desert , the sides of roads , and vacant lots were getting full of trash . The areas that stopped charging , suddenly got a whole lot cleaner ……………….imagine that !

    • Thanks for a dose of realism, TR. While the most of the post’s suggestions are good ones in a general sense, don’t know how applicable they will be when you are doing the best you can just to survive. You will probably be happy to find something to eat regardless of what kind of container it is in – scavaging is the name of the game.
      Thanks for sharing, Estar H.

      • I try to buy my outdoor gear with things like that in mind as well , an example being the spetznaz shovel over a folding shovel , reason is I may not always have time to unfold it , and the simpler the better . Both are about the same size and I really dont mind a handle , its easier to grab fast and makes a nasty weapon .

  3. SurvivorDan says:

    Nice article.
    I recently began stockpiling disposable plates, bowls, cups and utensils. As I am in the Sonoran Desert I am very concerned about using precious water for cleaning and yes I have cleaned plates and pans with gravel and grit (not always great results in terms of cleanliness/hygiene). Granted you are talking about being in the wilds and I won’t haul a great cache of disposables to the wilds but initially it can be a great way to save water, detergents and manual labor. As well as assuring that fresh dinnerware and utensils are very clean. Used plates, left at a distance from camp, that have dried out may be used for tinder/kindling as well.
    That said….good topic. Thanks for taking the time to offer your thoughts.

    • Hi Dan. I agree. I use paper plates at our off grid survival camp, which is where I like to stay for as long as possible.

      • SurvivorDan says:

        “…our off grid survival camp, which is where I like to stay for as long as possible.”

        My folks are in their late eighties. May they live to be a hundred, but whenever the good Lord calls them home, I intend to go to that kind of place (off grid – peaceful) and just stay there. Someday…

        I will become OldManDanInTheWoods. ;)

  4. JP in MT says:

    Great post. “Black” water has always been a concern of mine. I like to go camping where there are few people and fewer facilities. I have several systems that work for extended short term (say up to 2 weeks) but still looking for longer term solutions that are more like home.

    • Hi JP, You could check out http://humanurehandbook.com/. Lots to think about there. Maybe we humans don’t need to create black water in the first place?

    • charlie (NC) says:

      JP if you had grown up in the 50’s like I did or before you’d know that everyone had a hand dug outhouse. Given diggable soil I could build one with a shovel, an ax or brush saw and some saplings in half a day. It wouldn’t be water tight but it would be shaded, private and clean.

      • JP in MT says:

        charlie (NC):
        O trust me I “know” outhouses. I worked the summers in the fields in the 60’s, my grandfather had a “2 1/2 holer” (2 adult and 1 child size), I served 20 years in the US Army (we have a FM on Sanitation). Plus I live in Montana where we have people who carpeted the bathroom and liked it so well they ran it all the way to the house!

        My “problem” is to get something along the lines of a composting toilet. Cost being the main issue now. I’d like something that is less dependent on civil services but close to the modern sanitation of indoor plumbing.

        I did get a grin from your statement as I started school in 1960.

        • Charlie (NC) says:

          Well since I started school in 1956 I’ve still out olded you. lol.

          I was thinking you were talking in the context of a temporary bug out camp sort of setting. For something more permanent
          I’ve played with some designs that are basically an out house attached to a small septic tank and vented so that the odors from the tank exit from a stack outside of the enclosure. All I have are just sketches and ideas. I don’t know if any of them would work correctly.

          • recoveringidiot says:

            Charlie (NC),
            Some time back the park service had a public out house down hwy 12 built kinda along your idea, I think they had a gravity tank and field line in the sand with vent up the back of the building. The toilet worked like a RV type, just a valve and water wash. I’m not sure its still there or not I have not been that way in some years.

            My parents lived just south(west?) of Atlantic beach for years before they passed. I helped my Dad build a septic system in the late 60’s. A 1k tank with a 25 foot line made of clay pipe with shingles over the gaps and covered with oyster shells and rocks. I don’t know for sure but I bet its still working, the place was sold in 2003.

            • charlie (NC) says:

              yep they use a lot of wilderness type toilets like that down this way. I can think of 4 or 5 within 15 miles of my house in parks. That’s a fancy version of what I had in mind but the same principle. What I would try would be
              large, maybe 6 or 8″ pvc run at a 45 deg angle down from the potty and out the back of the “house” with a flap at the end. Then behind the flap would be a stack going up to vent and down, maybe at an angle into the tank.

              I’m about 30 miles as the crow flies nnw of Atlantic beach.
              It’s kind of hard to go S/W from atlantic beach and keep your feet dry as the beach runs more or less E to W. I suspect you mean they were west or North west from the beach. That would put them across the sound in Bogue or Cape Carteret area. Or maybe they were down the island in Salter Path or Emeral Isle? That would be more or less due west. I’d be willing to bet that tank is still working and the effluent never gets more than a foot or two out of the tank before it drains through the cracks of the first couple of tiles. That is very pourus sand in that area.

      • j.r. guerra in s. tx. says:

        My brother is currently building a screened area for showering and restroom privacy (#2) for the outdoors. Using 4 x 4 vertical posts at corners, 3 sides are made using wood pallets (free!) with a plywood door for remaining side (spring loaded self closing hinges). The bottom of pallet is about 12″ off grade, and there is about 2′-0″ above that, where another pallet is covered with a plywood roof deck covered with some 15# scrap building felt for actual roof. The floor will likely be concrete block or similar material.

        For males #1 restroom use, we took a page from the military and dug in a length of PVC pipe buried at an angle. The pipe was filled part way on inside with gravel to act as a French drain. A soft drink can covers the opening when not in use.

  5. j.r. guerra in s. tx. says:

    This is a good article, thank you for posting it.

    Its amazing how quickly the flying pests accumulate around dinner time. A screened area (porch or cover) can be much easier and safer to eat in. Eating after dark also has it hazards – if you wear a headlamp for hands free lighting, you get a whole lot of bugs attracted to the lens, which is just above your face – NICE! Speaking of food, also keep an eye out for the food crumbs that are dropped – ants materialize out of thin air! A small piece of food sacrificed at edge often attracts the bugs over there, while you eat less troubled by them.

    Tortillas make it possible to eat many foods without a plate. Whether it be grilled meats or foods on a skillet, you use the tortilla to wrap your your food and eat it. Many times, you don’t even need utensils to serve the food, though moist foods are tricky. Tortillas are cooked on the spot, making storage for them non-existent.

    • Hi JP, thanks for writing. You could check out http://humanurehandbook.com/. Lots to think about there.

      • I’m sorry JR — that reply about humanure was meant for JP :-(

        I love your comment about the headlamp. Never thought about it attracting bugs. Pretty funny. I wish I was a cartoonist. And it would be nice to have an accomplished tortilla maker in camp!

        • j.r. guerra in s. tx. says:

          No problem sir – happens to me all the time.

          Should have also mentioned above – dollar stores often have some type of small metal containers for Danish cookie or other dessert – these can be recycled for critter resistant containers. About 2 1/2″ in diameter x 6″ tall.

  6. Great Post!
    After living a tent for up to 6 months a year (until a few years ago), I am a absolute fanatic when it comes to keeping a camp clean.
    I left a semi- permanent hunting camp in the wilderness to take a trip home for a few weeks.
    Instead of packing out all the food by mule, because these camps are only accessible by foot or horseback, 15 miles in and out. I decided to store it in plastic, then in metal, then in a LARGE cooler, duct taped shut.Those coolers were HEAVY. I could not budge them. It was COLD, freezing day and night.I have done this before. Items in the coolers were mostly canned goods, canned beans, unopened coffee, crackers, and mini candy bars. I am pretty sure the demise of the entire camp was due to those candy bars.
    Our tents are the Army Surplus 30×60 heavy duty canvas OD green. They survived the Viet Nam war and had quite a few burn and bullet holes that were patched. We had wooden side walls and floors because of snow, wind and mud. Very sturdy, locked up tight.
    Ammonia bombs (balloons filled with ammonia) were scattered all around camp. Bears normally HATE those! You could tell by the marks on the ground.
    A 500 lb black bear, ripped through the side of the cook tent. I mean shredded! I should have left the door open. Tore through everything. Scattered and broke tables, chairs, wood stoves. Drug the coolers outside (why?), bit and clawed the lids to shreds. If I had any reason to wonder what was inside the tops of coolers, I had no doubt now.
    He opened the coffee, yuck! Threw it to the side.
    He opened the Rice Crispy treats, threw the wrappers down, and ate the treats. UNBELIEVEABLE!
    He couldn’t get the mini candy bars out of the wrappers so he ate them whole. I know all this because I found the wrappers in his scat a couple days after I got back.
    I named him Snickers and I know what he weighed because the Game Warden put him down a month after that, and brought him to me to see. He was aggressive and dangerous. He was trolling the hunting camps and because we were in one place for so long, the smells were intense. Even though we were very clean.
    My 357 Magnum never left my side after that. Or my dog. RIP…. Snickers.

    • Well it’s good to know I’m not just blowing smoke here! Our bear is pretty well behaved, so far. He came back the next day while I was at church and tore through some plastic trash bags I had stashed, waiting for a guy with a pick up to go to the dump. But he hasn’t torn apart my camp, thank goodness.

      • p.s. I am going to save this story and share it with my friend who buried her leftovers. I think she’ll enjoy it. She seems to attract all sorts of critters, even when she’s not burying garbage!

      • Lol. Your bear is just getting a taste I’m afraid.
        I have a friend who peed her pants the other day when she walked out on her deck with a cup of coffee and a bear was sitting, drinking out of her hummingbird feeders. She threw the cup at him, ran back in the house, and locked herself in the bathroom with the phone. I had to come over to talk her out. Well, I also had to come over to remove the ti-niny water snake out of her laundry room. Wuss.
        I can feel your friends’ pain with the critters. We have a regular wildlife zoo here at night. All feed has to be put away. Electric fences get turned on. Trash covered with tarps and heavy straps .Live traps set when we feel like it. I get tired of burying skunks.

        I once woke to a skunk looking up at me one night in my bedroom. Hubby left the back door open. I just covered my head with the comforter and went back to sleep. I don’t know how he got by the dog, I wasn’t getting up to find out. Of course he went out the same way he got in and all was well.

  7. Raccoons are another pesky critter , way too smart for their own good . 4-5 raccoons will make a camp site look like a bomb went off .

    • SurvivorDan says:

      Relate to dat. I once had a campsite virtually destroyed by a big boar raccoon. I know how big he was and his gender because of the depth of his prints and the length of his claw marks. Also i examined his scat and calculated that……okay….actually he was still sitting in a tree at the camp when I returned and dropping pieces of Oreos to add insult to injury.
      In my wrath, I was tempted to shoot him but settled for a volley of slingshot propelled projectiles to drive him off. Ate only boiled rice and Kim-chee that night. The only pot he hadn’t messed with had the Kim-chee in it. Apparently raccoons don’t like Kim-chee. Go figure…..

      Ah-ha! Surround your campsite with gobs of stinky Kim-chee! Brilliant!

      • SD,
        LMAO! Stinker. So make fun of my writing style….Why in the world would anyone take Kim chee camping? And, Oreos are not weapons.

        I would think that beans, pickled eggs and beer would be enough to keep the critters away. Works for my husband. And I know THAT because of the green fog that kills all plant life and makes skunks want to commit suicide in shame.

    • T.R. they sure can they can take the lids off pickle buckets! I couldn’t believe my eyes!

  8. Good article. As I am new to this blogsphere, I do have one thing to add. I am a backpacker and deal with varmits, water, food and food waste as a transient visitor of the wild often. I follow this simple rule. No food where I sleep. No eating where I sleep. No food storage where I prepare and consume my food. I create a triangle of 100 yds at each leg. It each tip of the triangle I perform each task. Point 1 = Sleeping, Point 2 = Food Prep and Consumption, Point 3 = Food Storage. I hang my backpack, food, and toiletries in solid tree at that third point with care as I need the food to survive the next leg of my journey. Note: The smell of the food permiates my pack and any item close to the bear bag during the day.

  9. Great article. We always cooked at-least 100 yards from our tent and hung all our food on a rope swung between two trees and above the reach of the largest bear we expected to see (This was griz country). We burned what we could and then buried any residue. Our only bad encounter with the bears happened when the mornings cook threw the grey water from washing dishes over some bushes and a 7 foot griz stood up and growled. However, BC Lions (red squirrels) and wolverines were harder to defend against. The further from civilization you are — the clearer you need to keep your camp.

    • Holy smokes,
      I am laughing about defending your camp against squirrels. They are killer. And Camp Robbers.

      • SurvivorDan says:

        The first time I took my old terrier camping I figured he would keep the squirrels away. Unfortunately, he was raised with ferrets and wouldn’t mess with the squirrels at all. They became bolder each day…..

  10. robin smith says:

    due to looking for some survivalists friends and not liking city people i got to looking for survivers club and here i am. didnt know i had already been living the good life except im stuck where im at for the moment but selling out and getting out but need your help. i dont know where to go. this is where i need your advice and friendship. ive lived alone for 10 yrs. only going out to get needs once a mo. . i see the hell coming here and saw the 6 blackhawks flying overhead. and the mentality of the cops change and threaten people with the patriot act,etc. i began packing away food, selling furniture, got a 4 wheel drive, more canning jars. extra lids. i was raised on the farm in mi. and survival was all we knew. we raised everything and took it to the streetcorners and sold it. we got 5 cents a week,as allowance. sears catalog was thick then. didnt need tp. and now i only need it once a day. dollar store sells washcloths in big packs for 2.00. as long as laundry has to be done do a couple extra cloths. been packing away meds .garbage cans are very useful. i make sure the lids are tight the checkout girl couldnt open it to make sure nothing was inside. i bought windshield wipers and walmart said they would put them on. i drove around to find a 80 y old man working under an umbrella and had something i his hand he was typing on. what is that ,i asked. we have to get your name and all peticulars including your vin number off the door . he opened it without asking and took a pic. of it then of me. whats going on. gov . has ordered it…anyone has work done has to be checked out. .. ive got to get out. im too crowded here. need space. id trade a bear anyday to these 2 legged preditors.i need friends who already know where to live.please let me know. robin…. phoenixrose80999@mygait.com . the phoenixrose? i survived a beating and stabbing many years ago. they killed my dog. that really ticked me off. nothing will get me down. please contact me.

  11. Big bore says:

    I’d first like to wish you luck in your endeavors and to realize that you are not alone in your quest. I would first suggest that you get a more discreet email name and address at the same time hoping that you are not using anything that would give anyone an idea of who you actually are or your location. More than surprised at the incident at Walmart – have not seen nor heard of anyone being asked to provide VIN or photgraph, but perhaps it has not made it this way yet. Where you relocate to is going to be determined a lot by what resources you have at your disposal and what your needs are. Keep a low profile with eyes and ears open, mouth closed, and you should be able to locate some like minded individuals as we can be found in many places – it just takes some searching. It sounds as if you have many useful skills that would put you in demand in a SHTF situation, or even before as you can teach these skills to others who wish to learn them. Keep on trucking down that road to self sufficentcy, to paraphase an old saying from my young hippie days, and you will find yourself where you wish to be.
    Be well, be aware, be resolute!