Advice on Avoiding The Government Watch List



I’ve recently seen a lot of ads for various print newsletters (ie: Lamplighter & Complete Survivalist). While they could be interesting, I’m a bit hesitant of getting on a mailing list like theirs (sending you my info for your great CD didn’t bother me at all LOL).

Am I being paranoid? Not only due to opsec concern and being on a list of someone who may have extra food on hand but I also don’t want to become associated with some radical group.

What you do think about these “publications”? Thanks!

Lisa,

The U.S. Government ‘s Consolidated Terrorist Watch List is no secret, but its official contents (those people on the list) are off-limits to the public. According to the feds, this is a list of people, “known or appropriately suspected to be or have been engaged in conduct constituting, in preparation for, in aid of, or related to terrorism [source: The White House].”

You or I could already be on the list and not know… As of 2007 there were over 755,000 names on the list of people both at home and abroad. I’m sure that number has ballooned since then.

Here is a good article on how people are “chosen” for the list. How do you find out if you are on “the list” according to the article:

“The easiest way to find out is to take an airplane trip. It doesn’t matter the destination, just try booking a flight and see what happens. The Transportation Security Administration that oversees air travel in the United States will automatically flag anyone with a name on the TSC’s master list. As a result, when you arrive at the airport, someone will likely pull you aside for an extensive security check and possibly questioning before permitting you to board.”

If you are concerned about being added to the list because of the type of publications you receive or because you are on a prepper / survivalist mailing list, you should look into a mail forwarding service. These allow you to have a mailing address in another state, you can also use an assumed name when signing up to receive mail from the sources in question.

I use a mail forwarding service (for certain types of publications wink) in AZ and have the mail forwarded to a P.O. box of a deceased friend who gave me his keys before he passed away – I pay the rental fee once a year to keep the box open. This has worked great for several years…

I’m sure Survivalist Blog readers have a wealth of other ideas on how to get mail deliver privately – please share your ideas in the comments below…

Comments

  1. Lint Picker (Northern California) says:

    Good luck staying off of a watch list. Whether you buy food or pharmaceuticals with a discount card or subscribe to NRA’s National Rifleman magazine, you’re on somebody’s list. And those lists are often sold to other groups. Eventually you get on the “wrong” list and the government takes notice. However, there are a few things I do just to make it harder on Big Brother. Here are some of the things I do, but not all of them because I never know who’s reading this blog. xoxoxoxox Janet Napolitano. :P (Yeah, I’m paranoid too)

    1)Signing up for magazine subscriptions by changing a couple letters in your first and last names can keep you off the radar. Then pay for them with a USPS money order.

    2)Use a post office box instead of your street address so it’s harder to find you.

    3)Subcribe to the magazine you want to get, and subscribe to another one of a contrasting theme to throw them off track. For exmaple, if you want to subscribe to Backwoods Home yet want to remain off the watch list, then subscribe to Architectural Digest as well and then give the magazine to a family member or friend or college library if you don’t want to read it. Then if you ever get questioned, you can claim you were merely acquiring contrasting info for a blog essay, rather than planning to move to a “compound” in the boondocks.

    4)Don’t subscribe to any publication that uses ethnic slurs, advocates violence, or aligns itself with a radical group. You can determine this before subscribing by requesting a sample copy or by reading their online descriptions. This type of info gets around the internet, so you can do your due diligence before subscribing to unfamiliar publications.

    5)Go to the library and read the magazine there. If your local library doesn’t have it, request they subscribe to it. If they won’t do that for you, request an inter-library loan in order to get one. You’ll need a library card, so get one under a name slightly different from that on your driver’s license. If the librarian notices the discrepancy, feign a predisposition to errors.

    6)Beware the internet, too, because every KEYSTROKE done on a Google site is LOGGED FOREVER. Nice, huh?!!

    • OhioPrepper says:

      LP,
      “KEYSTROKE done on a Google site is LOGGED FOREVER”
      Not really. Trends are sorted and ranked, and perhaps general category information for an IP address, but there simply is not enough physical storage on the planet to store all keystrokes even for 1 day of Google searches. These rumors are part of what keeps us on edge.
      Prior to the fall of the Soviet Union in the GDR (East Germany) the Stasi (German secret police) were rumored to have tapped every phone in the country, and were feared by all. After the fall, it was discovered that the Stasi could only tap a few hundred telephones at a time, but had everyone so paranoid that all citizens were in essence, Stasi agents. If I heard you discussing something against the state, and I didn’t turn you in, then when they came for you, they would surely also come for me because I knew what you were doing and didn’t turn you in. Therefore, I will turn you in to protect myself. While in retrospect this may seem a little absurd, nevertheless, it’s what can happen when we see spooks hiding behind every tree and watching our every keystroke.
      I have no doubt that there are lists out there. As an NRA Life member, NRA and Ohio certified instructor, CHL holder, member of many other organizations, and one who has sent numerous missives to my congress-critters, I am no doubt on one or more of them. Keep in mind however, that there are more than 300 million people in the country, and among them are real terrorists, criminals, gang members, and members of various hate groups on both the left and the right, so I’m really not so vain as to think that someone is looking specifically at me.
      The fact that I’ve passed numerous background checks for my CHL and certifications and memberships, and that I still fly with no more hassle than most, would seem to confirm that thought.

      • Lint Picker (Northern California) says:

        OP, I defer to your knowledge on the matter. However, I still don’t trust Google and its close ties to the current administration. Did you read the link that Ellen provided (below)? I think Google would be instrumental in providing that information to the TSA and DHS and that can be good if we’re talking about real terrorists and it can be very bad if we’re targeted merely because we own PPDs or read survivalist blogs. I say screw Google and their sick connection to the gov’t.

        • Lint,

          I don’t think you are too far off of the mark. Technology has changed radically over the past 5 years & the ability to store information & automate that process is highly doable.

          In my business I have to sign into a secure server in order to access what I need. They have changed the access systems fairly often & we were using a random access number consisting of 6 numbers and letters, provided by a hand held device for the past year. The latest change which was just implemented, is the most interesting …

          We now set up our sets of passwords BUT the security system now analyzes the person trying to gain access by the way the keystrokes being used & remembers it! I spoke to one of the security guys and apparently everybody has a unique way they type (speed, cadence & pressure) and the system logs each user and can differentiate who is trying to access the system.

          I thought it was baloney & tried to use a friends access (with him there) and it locked him out. So is it possible for Google to do that with billions of dollars & the NSA behind them? It certainly is not impossible.

    • Google doesn’t store your keystrokes I’m sure but they do store your internet searches by your unique IP address. I am generally a trusting person but these folks deserve watching. They have visited the white house several times.

      I know for a fact that their searches are returning more liberal hits that they were 6-12 months ago. I switched to Bing. I will never use Google again.

      • MOPrepper says:

        The Google founders have both stepped down and NSA is running the show now. That’s old news by now.

      • Yep. They store your search queries, just like emails, for a minimum of 2 years. But a year or so ago, our friends in Gaggle basically told the Fed that they’d be happy to “secure” all the information on search queries by storing them indefinitely.
        It’s been long rumored that Google is a CIA asset now. Whether that’s true or not I can’t tell, but their allegiance to Big Bro definitely tells a lot of who they’re in bed with.
        To safeguard yourself, use an anonymous server, or proxy, such as anonymouse.org to go to Google, or use other search engines such as Ixquick.com (although not as good it doesn’t store your IP), or use dogpile.com which pings google, yahoo, etc. for searches and delivers the results.
        Or, use a proxy sever to go to dogpile and really throw them off.
        Get creative.

    • axelsteve says:

      A buddy of mine goes to the local junior colleg and uses there computers. He lurks on above top secret and some spook sites.He used to work at the bohemian grove and is really into the underground movement. He tells me remember,don`t look up. That way the facial recoginition cops won`t see you. Steve

  2. I am giving this link to Rawles site, written by an official.
    You all may have already read it.
    http://www.survivalblog.com/2011/03/beware_of_homeland_security_tr.html
    I believe they may have just about anything they want on us. It starts minimally with birth records, then becomes primary with the DMV. Plus all the other agencies you have to give information to.
    I believe that the DMV is one of the most devious institution’s out there. All other agencies depend on it.
    The article at Rawles tells about the turn around in training and thought process. I believe this to be very true. On top of the mentality they get in their training to become officer’s of the law or officials of some sorts, all summed up as cop mentality, they are now brainwashing the puppies. Now ain’t that just great.
    Well as far as getting a subscription to a magazine that they feel is subversive, seems they have us running scared already. I do believe you should be cautious. But remember this, they already have Christians hiding and keeping their mouths shut. They can’t preach against faction’s. You can’t pray in public. Or use God’s name unless it is in vain.
    I have no sound advise. They could be reading this as I type it. But they can hang it in their ear.

    • mountain lady says:

      Thanks, I was just about to post on that article, but decided to wait until I read all the posts. I live in the boonies and do not know if our locals are making lists. I do know that this county is trying to adopt UN agenda into our county general plan, and this being the biggest nannie state in the union, I cannot disregard the possibility that the DHS is training our law enforcement. I am a bit paranoid, but am trying to keep my head down, make no waves, and just keep everything I think to myself. Trust in God, he is our only hope.

      • axelsteve says:

        Awoman Mountian Lady! ( said that you being a woman. I agree that God is our only hope. Jerimah 10/23 brings out that earthly man cannot direct even his own step. Do not put your trust in man who no salvation belongs. Steve

      • Hey mountain Lady, this is the mountain Goat. Yeah, without Jesus, we’re sunk. Plain and simple. Not too sure where you’re at, but I have an idea based upon your vague description. To that I say, vote with your feet and leave when you can. Where I’m at, after you pick out the pacifists, Democrats, and degenerates, my State could probably muster a good 500,000 man army to fight back if they tried to take our State.
        Funny thing though, we’re not fighting a government, we’re fighting a system. A system of locusts that show up with their funny money as the backbone and using Corporate schemes to provide themselves greater funding, they use their mercenary companies to enforce “compliance” on the streets, and the IRS to ensure compliance in the house. It’s as if satan himself realized that governments were inept and chose Corporations instead to do his dirty work, and then integrate that into legislation of the body politic.
        It’s not a country, it’s a company, and they can lose if we decisively engage. But there lies the problem, because money speaks honey to the ears and few can turn away from it.
        As far as lists go, they only stick to the big ones in areas like “ours”. But going underground and constantly moving keeps them on a trail…behind but never ahead. Whatever lists they do have come from the blowhards who were dumb enough to make themselves cannon fodder for a movement. Don’t worry too much, but safeguard yourself, and be ready for anything. :D

    • Ellen, When I read your post I got a funny thought. They can find all this info on us but they can’t find obama’s birth certificate? Ha-Ha! How ironic.

      • Mountain Lady
        Paranoia is a good thing taken with a big bite of common sense.
        I believe all things will start in the big cities and work their way outwards. So the lists are not complete. But never-the-less the smaller area officials probably have had letters, bullit-tin’s and invites to seminars themselves.
        I have always told my kids to be careful, keep their eyes open and watch their back.
        GA Mom
        They can find his birth certificate. But who wants to pay the $14 or so dollars for it. Probably not part of all this defunct zillion dollar deficit spendings.

  3. MD,

    I cannot believe that you are bashing the TSA – they are here to protect our country & us!

    Ok, the joke is over – what a crock of crap that they are protecting us! I am very irritated at this idiotic watch list because it is a way for Big Brother to get to us so, I say avoid all opportunities for them to get information.

    I am not one to buy into all of the paranoia bullshit that seems to swirl around these days but when irrefutable facts come out about “innocent” personal information gathering, I say enough!

    One thing that was pointed out to me was the fact that Google offers some kind of free phone service and or way to store all of your friends/family/contacts – including phone numbers, in their database and was a way to gather information – not as a service as they claim. This seems to be becoming more prevalent in other large online systems.

    What is to prevent the government from coming in and extracting & duplicating all of this information for later use – in the name of “security”?? It could be done very easily in the name of a “national emergency”.

    Fortunately, I have never uploaded any contacts into any source – primarily because I was too lazy & did not want to duplicate efforts from my hard drive. Further, I do not use credit cards & use other mailing addresses like you to keep out of their loop.

  4. Tomthetinker2500 says:

    MD: This one is about as comforting as reading the plot set up in a Tom Clancy book. One can find themselves on somebodies list rather quickly. I am a life member of a certian ‘gun club’. I sent in a letter of’ ‘opinion’ to my nations leaders and I recieved a response from not my ‘elected one’ but… the BATFE. Whose list am I on now…. not a question, more a statement. I’m a Vet with a security clearence, a CCW holder and I currently work in what is posted as a “Federal Trade Zone”. Crappolla MD… whats a fella to do? This is a real issue for the lot of us that surf in and outta places such as this one and maintain and ‘collec’t what we do. This sort of record keeping will cost us all some…. thing some time. Gawd.. paranoia pops outta it’s vile lil hole. I ‘hope’ to keep as low a profile as one can when wearing a flag on their head.

    • blindshooter says:

      I’m like Tomthetinker2500 in that most of the places I work do background checks. I’ve bought guns from the .gov in the past involving more background checks. CCP holder, more background checks. My prints are on file in lots of agency’s. The NRC will do a “through” background check to say the least, your references will be asked for more references…..
      I’ll bet “they” know if you hold a NRA competition classification card(esp a LR HM) or the like from another organization. Trying to hide anything is wasted time for me, I’m cross matched and typed nine ways from a-hole to appetite. I’ll bet it’s a lot worse than we’ll ever know.

    • I’m a vet too bro, and what I’ve learned is to NOT claim PTSD. 140,000 Iraq war vets lost their gun rights because of the PTSD claim by the VA. You fight for these losers, and their response is “f*ck you very much”, and over a hundred soldiers/Marines lose their right to bear arms.
      As a soldier, I think we’re not living up to the oath we took when we first swore in. And I think you know what I mean.

  5. Tomthetinker2500 says:

    ………….. dang! read that as “… my head..”

    • hey in german that’d be Meine Kopf, not saying anything Tom just you can draw a conection from the simplest of things. Things that mean nothing, till looked at with evil intent. A simple typo is now a Nazi referance, go configure.

  6. http://www.amazon.com/How-Be-Invisible-Essential-Protecting/dp/0312319061/ref=pd_sim_b_3

    Above posted is a link to JJ Luna’s book How to be invisible. This book is comprehensive on staying off the radar completely. I read it about 5 years ago and the ideas in the book are simply indispensible. It goes into how to hide your address using a ghost address, avoiding DMV and drivers license tracking, hiding titled vehicles legally by using a LLC and much, more. As he states in the book, if you do one thing and one thing only, never again associate your name at the address where you live. There is no erasing it once that happens…

    • Lint Picker (Northern California) says:

      If you buy the book, you’ll be on a watch list. If you check out the book from the library, you’ll be on a watch list. Once a kid is born in this country, a SSN is assigned to him/her and that’s the end of being a “private citizen”. Nope, don’t believe there is anyway to avoid being on a list.

      • Lint Picker – You have just stated the truth. Additionally, the more you make attempts to try to stay off a list, the more you’re likely to be on one.

        I’m more concerned about private, business or corporate “snoop” lists. Taking ordinary precautions such as using a PO Box, opening a UPS Store suite, having an unlisted phone number (with address omitted so that it doesn’t appear in those hard-bound commercial directories), using Pay Pal, etc.

        Otherwise, since 9/11 being on a watch list is a fact of life for anyone who had done most of the things made in comments to this post.

      • The book states you would have to move completely to start being untraceable. Once data is saved it never goes away, I am not arguing that fact. But if you are moving, following the steps in this book can really help you to become very difficult to locate.

    • Funny you mention that book Slik ….

      My original Google search for “survival” skills lead me to a real radical website that was interesting to say the very least. It talked extensively about removing yourself from the government’s ability to find you & essentially becoming invisible while living pretty much anywhere you choose.

      The style with which it was written, as well as content, seemed to have some real inside knowledge (CIA, NSA or ??) as to easy ways to accomplish this goal. The included photos were very graphic and they explained of how they positioned themselves & infiltrated areas undetected. It was spooky, fascinating but bordering on creepy.

      It was way off from my original search but I book marked it to come back at a later date to read. Well, I came back to it a few months later and, as you might have guessed, the website vanished without a trace – literally. No reference on the Whois lists & other sources. I think it got to high up on the government watch list.

      It is most definitely a brave new world.

      A friend once told me “take heed – the higher up the ladder you go, the more your butt shows.”

      • Strange about the website, too bad it wasn’t cached! Ggood advice about the ladder for sure also!

        I grabbed the book off a library shelf on a whim expecting it to be some hokey BS like any other books I’d read about becoming untraceable or disappearing. It was apparent right away this guy knew what he was talking about. There is truly no way to completely disappear, but you can make it very, very hard to find or track you if you do things right. I don’t find it necessary to do this in my life right now, but it is great knowledge to know if it ever gets to the point where you would want to leave and be very hard to track…

  7. riverrider says:

    the way i look at it, if all of us are on some list, it’ll take them 50 years to get to us all. i’ll be gone by then..that being said, if you buy more than one gun at a time you’re on a list by law now, and even though prohibited from sharing CCW permit info with anyone outside of the city/county of origin, i know they do. it comes up on the computer in the car when an officer pulls you over. i say molon labe.

    • Lint Picker (Northern California) says:

      Molon Labe! Yes, exactly. You’re right, there are a whole lot of us and we should remember that. Safety in numbers!!

    • Annie Nonymous says:

      Yep – harsh reality is the firearm thing makes you permanently traceable…

      There was a story of someone who had a firearm stolen out of a range bag, and found out about the theft when the cops called him THAT NIGHT… he looks in the range bag, and oh shot, how did that go missing, yessir, be right down to pick it up.

      As the story was related to me, the guy was on his way to the police officer station (without the rakes and shovels and implements of destruction lol) to pick up his pistol, when it hit him… he hd bought the firearm when he lived 300+ miles from his then current home, there was NOTHING that tied his that there to the former there… yet the cops not only traced it to him, but knew his home phone number to call him to come pick it up…

      Now, this was a bunch of years ago… but it shows just how insiduous the whole list thing is. Once you’re in the system, you’re known. What he told me – and I remember the look in his eyes when he said it – was that he was joking with the cops, and the cop doing “property control” had told him they punched in the serial number, it came up with a full readout on the owner… Who, where, when, address history… all from that serial number.

      Tells you something about “innocent gun registration”. He said he ended up selling that pistol (on consignment at a gun shop) to get it disassociated with him.

      By the way – that happened just before September 2001. Something to think about…

      Big Brother? Is here. Has been for a while. While “off the grid” is a nice thought, it’s hard to imagine any of us are truly “off the grid”… yo can only lessen your footprint, but I’m not really sure you can ever “erase” it. Regrdless of what these books say.

  8. MD – I’m pretty sure your on a whole bunch of “terrorist” lists with our benevolent government.

  9. Alex (Canada) says:

    I just read these things in the store.

  10. j.r. guerra in s. tx. says:

    Pretty soon, they are just going to have to extend that southern Border Wall around the entire country, any thing you do or say can be held against you.

  11. Well I know Im on that list, because I have been keeping up with Jesse Ventura on TRu tv. He talks about all the conspiracy theories, like 911, Consentraion camps, Plum Island etc. To Stay home or bug out? That is the question. I also visit Prison Planet with Alex Jones. Im done. Put a fork in me.

    • Terri I love that “I’m done, put a fork in me.” Never heard it before.

      I am probably on many lists. Gun permits, NRA membership, Palidin catalog, Anarchist books you name it I done went and done it. Yee Haw!
      Who cares. Bring it on. The only thing they will find when they get here is an old broad that is a double shot over the line.

  12. Rick3Freedom says:

    Well I believe we are all on the list also and I also agree with Riverrider.
    My thoughts are; they will have to have a lot of help to locate us all, but I also believe that a lot of the ones that will be looking for us are thinking the same thoughts as us. They have families that they will be wanting to protect and will band with us. With that being said, NOT ALL of them. There will be ones that are brainwashed and will try to take us down or get control. But I think when the SHTF, the true Americans will stand up and fight. So I think our odds are pretty good. They will get the “sheeples” first.

    • mountain lady says:

      I doubt they will go after the sheeple, because they don’t even have a clue that anything is wrong, unless they have flown somewhere recently. Last night I read the History of the Rothchilds, on the Rense websight. We have been totally taken. The only hope we have is that there are still more of us than them. That scared me so bad I only slept a few hours last night. The truth is coming our and they just hate working in the daylight. Like I said before, only God can save us now, and yes I am becoming more paranoid every day.

  13. Jim Murphy says:

    I am only interested in providing a decent life and living for my family. If that is something worth “monitoring”, so be it. Someone is going to “bored to tears” when they get to my file.

  14. I think I’m less afraid of being on a government list than just being out there for some nut to look up on the internet. The govt can’t do anything in an organized fashion. I’m with Riverrider, I’ll be gone before they would start looking my direction, and I’m not that old :D If you search your name on the internet, you will get your address, close relatives, and directions to the address if you want them.
    You can buy pretty much everything down to blood type. I subscribe to one magazine and it has nothing to do with prepping. I disconnected my home phone last year. I don’t fill out forms for anything. If I do, I list my work address and phone.
    I too have to endure the TSA background for my job. Fingerprints, the whole package. Guns – on the list more than a few times.
    I was a victim of identity theft several years back and had to go looking for “me” on a long list of potential creditors. They had my name spelled 6 or 7 different ways. Lint P is correct, most places don’t care if your name is spelled right or not, as long as they get payment. Funny thing is, I had a job many years back investigating fraudulent accounts with the company I worked for. I knew every trick in the book and it paid off. One or 2 letters moved around and a name can be lost.
    Ha! Sheri isn’t even the correct way to spell my name. Sounds the same, but different!! :) :)

  15. MD, why trigger everyone’s paranoia? fear takes away from one’s energy to prepare.

    • Sam,

      I’m not triggering anything – a question was asked and I responded…

      • clearly you’re the publisher here. you chose what letter to respond to and decided how long of a treatment to give this topic.

        now you got your readers running around trying to take stock of whether or not their search term history and other internet activity has them on watch lists. it’s impossible to know if you’re on a watchlist. there is no way of knowing even the criteria of being added onto a watchlist. so, why bother people with an unknowable hypothetical?

        i read this blog to develop a sound strategy and to develop a bit of clarity. being worried doesn’t help my goals.

        • Sam,

          You are correct, I am the publisher here and I do choose what is posted and as the publisher I don’t have to explain to you why a post was published. You have a choice to skip that post if you don’t find it useful (or stop reading altogether). Anyway if you are worried about wasting your time on this post why take the time to comment on it?

          • axelsteve says:

            I think this post is interesting. I used to buy the soldier of fortune magazine when I was a teenager and obviously paid in cash at a news stand.I do not know if that magazine is still around but I would do the same thing if I wanted to read it.I am probably on a list beacus the last time I have flown was back in 1981. I think if I fly again that they will give me the cavity exam. Steve

        • Sam- rather than take MD to task for what he publishes on- may I remind you- HIS blog, why don’t you develop some paranoia? ‘Impossible to know you’re on a watch list’? Um, man are you ever wrong, not that it matters. The criteria is out there if you cared to search for it (others shouldn’t have to and won’t do your homework).
          If you’re not worried, then why are you prepping? Trust me, your being paranoid is the reason you’re prepping. And paranoia is worrying. And guess what- it’s helping your goals.
          Shy III

    • Sam, I don’t believe this is triggering paranoia or fear. Knowing what is really going on is why we all prep to begin with. It only pushes us to prep quicker. I don’t see fear here, I see determination to be ready for anything that comes our way.

      • mountain lady says:

        Exactly, Sheri. My mother expected what is happening now to happen years earlier, and she is the one that got me into prepping in the 70s. I always tried to have extra on hand. Before Y2K was when I started prepping big time. I was ready. We got a reprieve, but now it seems to be getting very close. I may be a bit paranoid, but that does not stop me from having a level head when it comes to being prepared.

      • yeah, but MD doesn’t know what’s really going on. he doesn’t work for DHS, FBI, CIA, NSA, or the other alphabet soup agencies. he doesn’t know about the internal policies that govern these lists. he doesn’t know. full stop.

        so, what we’re left with is speculation, which spurs paranoia.

        • Sam, You have no clue what MD knows. You don’t know what I know or anyone else here for that matter. It is a topic he chose to discuss because it’s important. We are all level headed adults and I don’t need you to tell me what I should or should not be discussing on my time. If you are only here to criticize, get lost!!

        • LOL, Sam- are you absolutely positively SURE MD doen’t work for one of the alphabet agencies?
          As to knowing the internal policies governing those lists… there’s a little piece of paper we like to call ‘THE Consitution’ which pretty much governs them, though I admit the NoSuchAgencies have taken great liberty with interpreting their roles.
          And there you go again with ‘paranoia’… gee, man- you got your prep on due to your own ‘paranoia’, not MDs. Unless you’re just trolling here, in which case how do WE know you’re not working for the Alphabet Soup Group and just trying to sow discord?
          (smile)
          Shy III

        • Sam,

          Don’t be so naive.

          I someone who does interrogations for a government agency & know their methods do not align – whatsoever – with the Geneva Convention. When information is needed, they get it by whatever method – that’s the (unwritten) policy.

          Agent Orange & Napalm circumvented internal policies as well.

          Lastly, I am not paranoid – I am positive people tap my phone, follow me & bug my house in fact, I think MD is a government plant trying to gather information on these subversive survivalist activities.

          PS

          Shhhhh, his name is not MD either …..

        • Rusty Shackleford says:

          normally i dont like to be so black and white about things.

          i also dont like giving an overcomplicated answer to a simple statement.

          so i’ll leave it at this.

          you’re a idiot.

  16. Well since we are talking about being put on lists. I just heard on the radio that either MO or St. Louis has a program going where you list that you have a vegetable garden. I did not hear the whole thing but the first thing I thought was I would not volunteer that info. Some body is wanting to know where to get food…Maybe?

    • mountain lady says:

      We started an organic Farmer’s Market a few years ago. To sell you had to have your garden certified, pay a fee for that, and then you could sell your extras. I declined to join in as I really don’t want the local govt. to know that I may have extra food in my garden.

      • I don’t think anyone is as hidden as they think they are. The eye in the sky knows everything that goes on around here especially outside like in gardens. They fly over my house at least twice a day in the summer checking to see if I am growing weed or something else illegal. I don’t know about their instruments, but I have heard they are able to tell if something is a tomato or weed.

        • OhioPrepper says:

          I don’t think that the instruments can tell the difference between a tomatoes or a begonia, but if by weed you’re talking about cannabis, then as I understand it, the leaves have a distinctive IR or UV signature during the daylight hours.

    • I recall seeing a similar situation, Buddy. In fact, recieved a letter/questionaire in the mail asking some pretty serious questions about my lifestyle. After reading it, I tossed it in the stove, have often wished I’d photcopied it and blogged it. Oh, well- half asleep most the time and the rest of the time I’ve got my eyes closed.
      Drat!
      Shy III

  17. I’m sure that anyone who owns a gun, buys silver or gold, blogs or visits sites like these is on some sort of freedom-removing/govt watch list. They’ll have a hard time taking us all out thats for sure.

    Another concern I have is what other type of list am I on? We’ve gotten orders from Honeyville & other sites similar to that and the huge boxes of food or whatever get delivered by UPS, Fed Expr or the Post Office with their name AND contents boldly displayed.

    I often wonder that if the shtf would their employees show up on my doorstep looking for a handout? If I was starving I’d rack my brain to remember where I delivered 10 loads of food. We’ve locked up most of our food storage but our cleaning lady has seen some of it (we can’t lock all of it up – not enough room). She asked about it the other day & I just brushed it off saying we got a lot of stuff on sale but I know she wasn’t buying it because she’s talked about her concerns about the future.

    I think I might be on several local people’s “food list” if the shtf. Even though I’ve only spoken to my parents, in-laws & brother about it. How the heck do you keep yourself off of THOSE lists?!

    • Why have a cleaning lady? If you want to maintain OpSec, seems you’d want as few outsiders as possible with access to any part of your home.
      This lady didn’t buy it, for sure- you know she didn’t- and now you’re on her list. Gosh, I wonder how many she’s told already?
      Shy III

  18. Not sure why I need to be concerned about being on a list.
    Public servants are generally to stupid to know what to do
    with their lists anyway.
    Maybe I’ll just put then on MY list.

  19. Dean in Michigan says:

    Wether you’re on a list or not I think is irrelevant. If the gov’t wants to make life hard on you, then you’re just SOL, they WILL find you.

    I agree with mountain lady, they will not go after the sheeple. They won’t have to, as said sheeple will already be lined up at the FEMA gates.

    This is how SHTF will work to our advantage. There will be so much going on, initially, that they won’t have time for door to door stuff. Dealing with rioting, looting, etc… will take all available manpower. That stuff will take time, and by then we will have adjusted accordingly.

    • templar knight says:

      Very astute, Dean, and right on target, which is why a true SHTF scenario would be beneficial to us vs. a slow-motion collapse like what we’ve seen in Argentina. A series of crises, each one getting worse, would allow the folks in charge time to find out who has guns, ammo, food, water and other supplies stored long term. I can assure you that your supplies that you paid for would be taken by the state, and you in trouble for hoarding.

      This is one reason OPSEC is so important. Even your close family has no need to be aware of what provisions you’ve made. You can store food for them, and they need not be aware of it. They can benefit after the fact.

      My advice, keep a low profile, don’t buy huge amounts of anything from a single place, but diversify your purchases. Don’t buy 6 cases of food from Honeyville at one time, don’t buy ammo in 1000 rd. cases, don’t buy 2 or more guns at a time, or a truckload of propane tanks. Buy something everytime you go to the store, visit the Farmer’s Co-op, shop at Wally World, Sam’s, Costco, Target, Gander Mountain and your local gun shops and sporting good stores. A post over at Rawles’ blog claims that retail personel at many large retail outlets are spying for the government, and giving them info on people who are buying large amounts of food, ammo, etc. Again, buy smaller amounts from several different retailers, and you will protect yourself from intrusive eyes. And pay with cash, not debit and credit cards. Remember….OPSEC! Your life depends on it.

  20. If you’ve ever got spam, you’re on somebody’s list- and undoubtedly on the fed’s list.
    Personally, I don’t worry myself with it- but I’ve ben on lists for fifty years, fully expect them to come for me.
    Well, of course I’m paranoid. In this society, if you aren’t paranoid, you’re nuts and the fed knows it.
    Shy III

  21. This was some good info to avoid leaving even more of a trail and ideas for to go on
    http://mindbodypolitic.com/2010/08/14/why-you-should-support-scroogle/

    “…it’s impossible to know if you’re on a watchlist. there is no way of knowing even the criteria of being added onto a watchlist.”

    ANd that’s how you know America has now become the same as the old East German state and all the others.

    For some, a sound strategy to develop might be to keep off the list, for others,… well, perhaps you can figure out how to screw with them?

  22. Since 9/11 and most likely a long time before that the internet has been under surveillance by the feds under the auspices of “security”.To all the paronoids like Sam out there , sorry but too late . Just the fact that your IP addy has made a connection to this site or any others the feds consider suspicious they can track you. The feds use tracking software that will boggle your mind, some ferreting keywords others using direct snooping of your data packets. Cell phones are the same. if you do not think they can track you or gather info on you than the only person you are fooling is yourself. My best advice to all who give a crap is this. Stick to your beliefs. Continue to prep for the safety and security of your families. Get networked with a clan, tribe, or militia whatever you think would be your best shot at safety and security. Above all grow you a set of nads and stop crying ! If you are gonna to sit there worrying whether you are on a list than you do not have the fortitude to survive anyways.

  23. MOFreedom says:

    Gentlemen:

    Lets all cough and see if the Man-Parts are still attached. If we stop letting all of this just ‘Happen’ to us we can have our country in Freedom and Not slavery!

    MOFreedom
    mofreedom2@yahoo.com

  24. I’m sure the government tracks all kinds of ‘potentials’, but the priority placed on people who subscribe to a given set of periodicals has to be low, and the names in there are most likely only used as one of many ‘hotlists’ when doing more serious searches for truly serious threats. Bottom line is, just subscribing to something won’t get you in trouble, so if you keep your nose clean you’re safe.

    • Lint Picker (Northern California) says:

      It’s getting harder and harder to “keep your nose clean” in this country. Things that used to be legal are now illegal and things that used to be illegal are now legal. I know of people who committed minor offenses and wound up being charged with a terrorist act – although they did no such thing. The problems for those people was the definition of “terrorist” had been changed and thereby put them into that category through very broad and outrageous parameters. Politicians change definitions, often without telling us they’re doing so.

      Yeah, I’m paranoid. I got that way because I’ve seen this country go from a relatively free one to a very dangerous one. The current administration claimed rightwing “terrorists” are the most likely to cause problems. That same adminisration refers to Tea Party patriots as rightwing extremists. It also ridiculed those of us who “hold onto” our “guns and bibles.” So that tells me they are not so worried about illegals coming across our borders with dirty bombs, but they are worried about conservative gun-owning Bible-readers who oppose their progressive ideology. Damn straight I don’t trust the government to leave me alone. And that’s despite the fact that I “keep my nose clean.” That doesn’t matter anymore – they set new rules without telling us.

      Oh, to be clear, I’m not ranting at YOU. I’m ranting at how backwards everything is in this country today. I’m ranting that we even have to contemplate watch lists. We’re supposed to be watching the government, not the other way around. But we fell asleep on watch and now we’re paying the price. We’re paying the price by being treated like the enemies when actually we are the backbone of this country.

  25. SrvivlSally says:

    I would say that you are not paranoid but just wondering and worrying that you might do the wrong thing. It stinks that many people are not certain about one thing or the other and that they might get into some real trouble. Boy, land of the free and home of the brave? It’s beginning to look more like land of the chained thinker and home of the unsure. If you are just one of the general public with no affiliations to active groups or people who are involved in certain types of things then you probably have nothing to worry about. Every human being has rights and those rights state that they can read whatever they want and believe whatever they want and do whatever they want (as long as reading, believing and doing whatever is not breaking any real laws such as murdering, speeding, stealing, manufacturing bawms infiltration/sabotage of government, etc.), and that is without the intent of causing harm to other human beings. No one can nor should assume that just because you read a survival, stock piling or homesteading magazine or book that you are a survivalist, have lots of things stored up or that you have a place where you are living or can live where you are “doing for yourself”. I would get on those company’s lists and not worry about it but just be careful about what you say while online, chatting, etc. because if you are not a criminal of any sort then you do not want your words to say otherwise. The facts say that a survivalist is not a terurist nor is it a kyller therefore you are not guilty nor would be of anything. Go for it!!

    • Lint Picker (Northern California) says:

      I like your creative spelling, but it won’t help you fly under the radar – they already know who you are. ROFLOL. :)

    • Any type of gubmint crackdown will be very similar to what faced our nation’s founders. The Brits went to Lexington and Concord if you recall to collect arms and stores. They didn’t get to be the biggest bully on the block by being stupid and reacted to the threat the Patriots became. Preppers, and any person or group will fall into the same category. Food stores will be seized as they have throughout history to keep the military and police fed so they would have the energy to enforce their will on the people while we slowly starve. Not a new tactic has been in use for millenia. Any actions will be preceded by Marshall law or edict that will deep six the Constitution and freedoms. Weapons will be attempted to be collected and anyone considered a threat rounded up or worse. Americans will have to face tough choices to defend life and liberty once again. As someone prior posted the sheeple will be no problem for the government, but Americans will need to unite and fight together, not waiting in a trailer of home for them to eliminate the threat you present.

      • Rick3Freedom says:

        “I” said the sheeple will be the first because they are not prepared and they will be led down to the gates of HELL by the progressive Gov. Then they ( un American gov supporter) will come for us, by that time we will be aware and be on the eye opener of awareness. But as I believe we all feel – they better be expecting the worst for themselves when they come for us (the true AMERICANS). As the saying goes – they have just opened a can of WHOOP ASS. I am a total believer in the constitution and if you come for the true blood of AMERICA, then you will get what you come for. I do not believe in trouble BUT!. Do not take my FREEDOM and I will not have to defend it, and things will be fine. If you TREAD on me and OUR COUNTRY you will wish you didn’t. To many true AMERICANS (service men & women) have Sacrificed their lives for our freedoms. I will back them any way I can and I will. I hope we all will never have to deal with this kind of eruption, but I hope you all are prepared for the worst & HOPE for the best. Sorry for the rant, but I am pissed for what is happening to our COUNTRY. We the working class can not support the worthless nonworking class. Like M. Thatcher said “The problem with socialism is that you eventually, run out of other people’s money”. I sure do hope we can get the country turned around and hope it is not to late. If we look back to the past, what do we see? Rome, can that happen to us? Dah! Yes it can and it sure looks like this gov is leading us this way. So for the list, we may or may not be on it. BUT let us all be prepared.
        Keep on prepping!

        • rpant2313 says:

          no be pissed this is our country and we allowed it to be taken from us. now comes the hard part taking it back.

          we all are on some list or another when they come for what is ritfully mine well a man has two purposes in life to breed and die and i am all done breeding.

  26. JNap is using hollow words to create fear. DHS wants people to believe that they are all-powerful, all-knowing. Name ONE project that DHS has proven it’s agency to be effective in. The entire umbrella agency should be dismantled as fast as it theoretically was organized. (Another story, another day….)

    It is obvious that Rawles realizes this too and his article details how some of the brainwashing propaganda can be used against We The People by the flip of the DHS-switch.

    The Feds from Oz…time to pull back the curtain to see what’s really going on.

  27. Lake Lili says:

    Funny thing about lists… I was crossing the border into the US in 2003 from Canada where I am a citizen. The boarder guard wanted to know three things (1) why I had gone to a “commie” grade school? (ans) in 1973 the only French school in Toronto also taught Russian; (2) why did I receive Subversive literature? (ans) was he refering to Backwoods home – bought for the articles, or Martha Stewart – bought for the pictures; and (3) was I still a member of the NRA? (ans) summer camp marksman program 1979-1981… I did say that if I could get clearance to work at a baseball game attended by George W Bush, then perhaps these weren’t issues. He didn’t agree… funny that list at the border…