H7N9 and S.I.P.D.E.

This is a guest post by Bam Bam

I started writing this article as a mind mapping exercise. I had written, “This is a test. This is only a test.” I wrote out the day’s developments of H7N9 and my dh got concerned. As you will read below, the CDC has placed U.S. hospitals on alert for H7N9. Minnesota has issued a health alert—they have sent samples from patients who have symptoms of H7N9 to the lab for testing. This has made him uncomfortable and we are off to Walmart and Sam’s Club to shore up our preps.

The purpose of this “test” is to help you fill holes in your preps. So what is S.I.P.D.E.? This is something my dh learned in motorcycle school as taught by a police officer.

  • S Scan
  • I Identify
  • P Predict
  • D Determine
  • E Execute

For example, I am approaching an intersection on my motorcycle. (This is my dh speaking right now.) As the light turns yellow, I scan the scene: forward, to the left, to the right, and rearview mirrors. Then I identify objects and events in my environment. To my left, a car is backing out of a driveway. The driver is elderly. To my right, a small child is playing ball on the sidewalk. I then predict potential hazards (accidents). The elderly driver may not see me and may pull out directly in my path; the child will probably stay on the sidewalk but if that ball goes in the street, the child may run into the street to retrieve it. Before these events even happen, I determine what I will do. Will I swerve, honk the horn or brake? In the case of the elderly driver, the horn is probably useless as the driver probably will not hear it. These protocols allow me to execute immediately. I will immediately brake while keeping an eye on the elderly driver backing out of his driveway; I will honk my horn to get the attention of the small child to alert him that there is an oncoming vehicle.

Let us apply this approach to H7N9. We begin by scanning the situation. As of this writing, there have been 102 cases with 21 deaths. There are no confirmed cases outside China. An international team of influenza experts arrived in China late last week to help Chinese officials determine the source of the virus. They have not yet determined how people are getting sick. The CDC has put U.S. hospitals on alert. According to Flu Trackers, Minnesota has issued a health alert for the new flu; they began testing patients who fit the CDC’s description of H7N9. We likely have 24 hours before the results of these tests become public knowledge.

Next, we identify potential hazards. H7N9 may be here in America, here in my neighborhood. We have a friend who paid $8000 for a trip to China. The lady who lives across the street travels to China and Hong Kong regularly on business trips. They check the mail at the same kiosk of mailboxes that we do. Flu can survive on nonporous surfaces for eight hours. Our neighbor to the left is an emergency room nurse.

Tomorrow’s paper may report the first cases of H7N9 in the U.S. The general populous may ignore these reports. Or panic may set in. We need to predict what people and institutions are going to do. There may be a run on grocery stores. Shelves may be emptied of essential items like bleach, flu medicine and respirator masks. Gas stations may run out of gasoline. If cases of H7N9 multiplying exponentially, authorities may order the public to shelter in place. Schools may shut down. Public transit may shut down. Grocery stores and gas stations may shut down. Think Boston. Not just for a day. But for six months.

Be grateful that you have been paying attention. You have 24 hours or perhaps even days before the general public is made aware of the situation. You need to determine now what you are going to do if those samples from Minnesota come back positive. My dh is a little disturbed by the possible cases in Minnesota and he has determined that both vehicles and his motorcycle need to be gassed up.

Last night he asked me if we had everything on hand we would need if we went on lockdown for six months. I took a deep breath, and then began an inventory. I came up with a list of things we would need. This morning he determined that we would take money out of savings and go shopping to get everything on the list. (We will use everything on this list anyway, so I am not concerned that we are jumping the gun.)

We are good in most areas but we need more acetaminophen. (Walmart was out of the big bottles last time I went shopping.) We have scripts that need to get filled. We need to stop by the local produce store to pick up raw honey. We need to bring our supplies of pet food up to six months. I have gone through all our preps and we need dish soap and napkins, tampons and cat litter.

Well, my dh is back from the gas station. I need to take a shower so we can execute our plans. Now do I think we need to get everything done today? I think we have more time to get our preps in order. But my dh has made up his mind. It is better to be prepared and not need the preps than to need and not have.

Here’s the question for the Pack. If you had 24 hours before H7N9 created a public panic, what would you need to do to fill holes in your preps?

Do you have enough ingredients to make laundry soap? Do you have enough cat litter? Do you have enough feminine hygiene products? Do you have enough prescription medication to last you for six months? What do you need to do today to get your family ready? Please share your thoughts below.

About M.D. Creekmore

M.D. Creekmore is the owner and editor of TheSurvivalistBlog.net. He is the author of four prepper related books and is regarded as one of the nations top survival and emergency preparedness experts. Read more about him here.


  1. I wonder where in Minnesota there are alerts. My Uncle worked for the U of M in their disease studies in labs with sample viruses and harmful bacteria sent from all over the world. He caught a few of the diseases he was studying. I wonder how careful these CDC and other University bio labs are with these diseases……

    • Donna,

      The report only said a hospital in Minnesota. I imagine that doctors around the country are sending in samples to get tested–just to be on the safe side.

  2. This was a good because there were a few things I was lacking as well.

  3. Well,I live in a different part of the country these days in rural N Carolina.Im on a small pension .so prepping has its place with people on a fixed income.
    They say your vehicle should be a top priority.So,Ive been paying down the credit card ,so I could get it overhauled,and got it to the shop last week.$2650,on a engine overhaul,said it d take 2 weeks,a old 85 Ford 6 cyl 2 dr model.
    The problem is, Ive been having some of the repair shops steal parts and mess something else up,while Ive had it in for repairs.My ma worked at the Pontiac Police Dept 14 yrs and stated 1/3 of the plainclothes use automotive for their plainclothes routines,so I should try some other field of endeavor,when I was a teen in the motor city.
    My neighborhoods full of plainclothes doing the work at home routines,and they even moved one in across the street doing a backyard bodyshop,adding 3 -2 car garages behing a doublewide.
    They like the women ,liquor,and women joints coupled to the work at home routines,especially the baptists that don t like licensed bars,or the mixed racial thing in such places ,rurally,it 45 % negro out here in the countryside,too.
    Anyways ,I ve been getting a few of em walkin across my 1 acre lot at 4 in the morning,and Ive had sabotage on my rides.Brakelines on 3 cars.electric troubles repeatedly,and to think plainclothes are making 60 grand a yr running this sort of rackets ,probably for police charities.
    They oubled the price of all cars in the past 12 yrst oo,while wages went up 18%.
    Im 4 miles to the city limits of the county seat of 24000 population,the whole county is 100 000 pop,2 counties west of Charlotte,NC.
    I m going to get the DVR cam system ,right now just have a couple CCcams.I ve had the chain and padlock under the hood,but they pick locks.
    When I go to the store ,they toss my crib,they can get away with anything if they say its drug related,incl this,and thats how they get away with the liquor,women ,and gambling thing,saying theyre using it as cover to finf drugs routinely.
    I got em telling me not to do the 4 leaf clovers for charity ,probably jealous Ive done 3.7 million over the past 23 yrs..Then they try to act like the nostrums and nutritional supplement /alternative approach is the same as contrabandillegal drugs,go figure,its been that kind of harrassment ,the whole time ,out here in the country.
    2/3 of my 4.5.6 clovers,went to the Red Cross for charity fundraising,and that had a lot of food earmarks in it internationally,orphanages urned into food growing co ops in Africa,Afghanistan ,Haiti,Pacific Rim,and Mexico,be advised.

    • khbostic, to get your car fixed honestly, just find a more urban but not slummy place that is not in that jurisdiction and get it fixed there. Chances are it’ll be better in that regard than wherever you are.

      After that, your cameras might help, at least so you know what is really going on – but if the whole PD is in on it then you’re only going to stir the hornets nest by complaining, and if you keep pursuing it up the food chain you should be prepared to move out of state because you will become even more of a target by complaining. But you can try that if you want. Keep in mind the cops might be using local thugs they have under their thumb to do this dirty work. Doing so would give them plausible deniability.

      Picking locks is EASY. I just learned how at the local hacker/maker space, from a cop no less LOL. He says common crooks just break the window, so they’re not worried about geeks knowing how to pick locks.

      Car locks are apparently a little harder, I haven’t been taught those yet, but house locks are easy – let’s say I can get into one with 5 cylinders inside a couple minutes. Another thing the cops do with houses they have under surveillance is take the cylinder out and remove all but one of the pins, then it’s really easy for them to pick, or they’ll even make a key that opens the one remaining pin. So, if you think they’ve targeted you that way, you can check your locks for missing pins in the cylinder, and if you find it that way, you know they’ve been there.

      To make it harder to pick a premises lock, you might consider buying a lock designed to deter picking, usually sold for commercial buildings. There are locks out there that are much harder to pick than a Quikset, which is essentially no protection at all.

      If you think they are targeting YOU, rather than just being corrupt with everyone, you might consider registering a car in the name of a trust you form and receiving mail related to it at an alternative address. That way when they pass that vehicle in the street they might not realize it’s you unless they know your face and you are in it at the time. You will need a trustee who isn’t you – preferably with a different last name. You can change the trustee if need be, too, from time to time.

      I hope this helps with your problem.

  4. worrisome says:

    I had the same thoughts as regards, the next time I am in a crowd, what I plan to have in my pockets vs a purse/bag/backpack. And the thought that I have too much of my supplies all in the same place. That thought came from the problem in West Texas. I don’t live near a fertilizer plant, but I near a forest a forest fire could have the same result and burn all my preps. I need to diversify more…

    • From my knowledge as being a former volunteer firefighter, grass and woodland fires scorch only an inch or less deep, that’s why grass resprouts first after a fire sweeps by. Burying your preps away from your house a few inches under the sod in a metal container will save your preps.

    • You should have in your pockets or in belt pouches at least: a multitool or small folding knife, lighter, and if you conceal carry, then a pocket gun. And your wallet and phone. You could possibly put some of these in a pouch on a length of paracord and wear it under your shirt, or if you are a girl then you can pin or sew a pouch to your bra.

      That way even if you are separated from your bag EDC, you will have those things. If you are deliberately going out into the field, you can put even more in your pockets – like maybe an Altoids tin size survival kit, energy bars, water tablets, 1st aid kit, etc.

    • I have a neat little back pack I found at hobby loby. It is just big enough to hold my id, a multi tool, some cash, a bottle of hand sanitzer, a lighter, and a few other small items. It attaches to a belt. Also while at the flea market yesterday I seen a vest (I am pretty sure it is a tactical vest) that had about 20 pockets on it. I told my husband I need one of those, he was too busy looking at a pair of rubber boots. Although my daughter looked at it and said, it still doesnt have enough pockets mom.

    • worrisome says:

      All great ideas ladies, thanks!

  5. Thank you Bam Bam. I made flu kits yesterday and sent them Fed X to my husband and sons who are out of state. I used your link to purchase 100 more masks from Amazon.
    This morning they filled their trucks and gas cans.
    As soon as I give them the heads up they will have enough fuel to make it home without stopping.
    They have cash, food, water, firearms and several routes planned. They should all be home with 5 to 10 hours.
    They each will have a room to stay in for a week in quarantine.
    I am thankful I do not have children in school anymore.
    I have elderberry tincture, syrup and tea.
    Wild Cherry Bark tincture is very good for respitory distress.
    Don’t forget something as simple as Breathe Easy tea by Traditional Medicinals. You can buy it at the grocery store and Walmart. I have a friend the has severe COPD and Pulminary Fibrosis. It gives her great relief.
    We will not be using Echinacea as we do not an immune system in overdrive. Taking vitamins, eating healthy, drinking clean water. Honoring self.
    I pray that this does not come to pass. It will be very very bad.

  6. Depending on what shuts down, I am a little lacking. Electricity and internet keep working, I have gone a month at a time repeatedly not leaving the house. Assuming the gas panics are sporadic enough after the first month, I probably wouldn’t even notice. (The car does put up with not being driven, it’s just the 100mpg that suffers.)

    Six months… What is the cheapest grain grinder that has a “just crush” setting? That’s the point of argument here.

    At the current for my cats… not enough food, but they are indoor/outdoor so that’s how I would catch it, assuming my husband didn’t come home. One knows how to catch mice and eat non-traditional food, but will be competing with a better hunter, the other is going to drive me nuts.

    Assuming I still have refrigeration, I will have food fatigue. Last time I tried the paleo diet this winter, it took less than a week for me to stop eating. I have plenty of rice and beans, but also 100 pounds of excess weight, so sitting around reading books and fasting shouldn’t be an issue.

    • Kelekona, for a grain grinder, get a manageable length of black pipe, put a rag or piece of foam around the top of it and duct tape it on (for a softer handle so you don’t tear your hand up), find like a coffee can or tall soup can, put a little grain in there, and bash it up and down with the pipe. That is the cheapest grain grinder I can think of. Then get a piece of window screening or a wire strainer, and sift out the small bits, put the big bits back and keep going like that.

      You can also use a coffee grinder or a blender, with small quantities, if you have electricity.

      OR, you can sprout the grain a little, and make Ezekiel bread out of that. It would be a lot softer if you sprout it, and will also be more nutritious.

  7. Bam Bam,
    Thank you for your timely and informative article about the flu and now this follow-up. I am very grateful for your continuing assessment of this flu.
    Yesterday, I went out and bought Lobelia tincture and Elderberry tincture, and oil of Oregano, and the Yogi brand breathing tea. I checked the cost of purchasing directly vs online thru Mountain Rose Herbs and determined that the additional cost was worth it to have it in hand. Thank you Michele for your herb knowledge and others, I believe it was Sw’t Tater. My son has occasional asthma and as we all know this does not help with the flu.
    I also purchased Mucinex and cold tabs at Sams. and I am going to purchase some additional Echinacea tabs to boost our immune systems.
    Bam Bam, if you have further suggestions for any items to have on hand for flu preps, since you just went thru yours, it would greatly be appreciated. Thank you so much for your articles, and the rest of the pack, you are great!

  8. Bam Bam:


  9. Hunker-Down says:

    Bam Bam,

    You knocked me off the fence. I ordered the elderberries from your link; until this article I had planned to procrastinate by just adding them to our Amazon wish list. Amazon is down to one left, this morning.

    Thanks for the needed kick in the head.

    • H-D,

      Even if H7N9 does not become an issue, the elderberry tincture will work on the seasonal flu and any other viral infection.

  10. Excuse the typos in the above post.
    My dad came from here in NC,while my ma was from Detroit areas suburbs.
    Ma had a dad that was born on the Minnesota /Canada border around intl falls,said they thought it was Canada when they got 500 acres,but it turned out to be Minnesota,so granddad was born in the USA,and got citizenship being born here.
    Granddad migrated to Detroit,couldn t get work in the car factories,so he played fiddle in a combo,in a police run illegal bar to get thru the depression.
    When things got better,he opened a small ma and pop restaurant.Thats where my dad met my ma.
    Dad went north the same way,trying to get a job in the car factories,after a couple yrs at NC State Ag and Tech.He was in the marine corps reserves,a police unit in Asheville ,NC which sent him to the Phillipines during WW2,so he had the G I Bill.
    So I was born up there,got a 2 yr college degree as well up there,major of Mental Health /Social Work,as I was saying the other day.

  11. Question: my local GNC only sells elderberry tablets made from elderberry powder. Would that help at all?

    • Michigan Mike,

      If you want to purchase something, I would go with Sambocal.

    • Mike, check the label, usually tablets are full of fillers so are less productive then the herb. It sounds crazy but check your local grocery stores organic section. I have one grocery store in my area that has a huge organic section, and the others only adequate, but I can usually find. If not there check you ethnic stores, most of them will sell herbal remedies.

  12. For intel,Detroits car factories are now 95% automated,so the type of workers they hire are robotic arm repair /and programming technicians.
    Picture a assembly line with robotic arms,all up and down the line as the vast majority of jobs have gone to this.
    I worked for a security guard company and was sent as a relief guard to a few plants among my other duty stations,once upon a time in the 70s.
    Back when my dad worked the car factories,in the 50s,he said it was 50% automated,Every time the unions got them a raise,they played musical chairs and took some more jobs to automate.They laid him off ,every other year back then.
    My dad suffered a back injury,had a piece of bone cut from his hip,and spliced across 3 vertebraes,a lamenectomy.Settled out of court for 5 grand and the 55 grand operation,pretty much blackballed from then on.
    So he went to Wayne St U and got his Education major in,specialty classes in art.Taught night school a couple yrs,but never made it as a teacher.
    He had 3 sisters that made it and another brother,all teachers,out of 15 kids in his farm family.

  13. BamBam;
    Discussed this with my ds and her family last night. I told her I would print off your article for her to read(they do not have internet at home). She works in a good size hospital, and they come across a lot of strange illness. Right now the hospital is full of patients, and they are sick from what appears to be the old flu symptoms.

    We are discussed having dinners once month(her schedule prevents more), so I took the list of “50 things missing” when a disaster hits. Her husband was asking her do we have this?? Do we have this? Then I asked them, are you set for 1 week, 2 weeks, how about 3 to 6 months
    in supplies so you would not have to be out amongst the public and I used the Boston lock down as an example. I think I finally got through to them(including the nieces) that we live in a time it is more important to be self reliant.
    My medical preps stink…so I will use your list as a guide line. As for prescriptions I am fine, my dh is weak on his inhalers, but we are in the process of solving that problem. Will discuss getting additional thyroid medicine from his doctor as a back up. He fits your age group and medical problems that this disease hits first. So you can bet I will be very proactive.

    • Becky,

      That is great. I think it was the possibility of a pandemic flu that has gotten my dh on board completely. You may find this list helpful.


      • BamBam;
        Thank you for the link to the supply list and mucus relief. I will print this off to see what I am missing for supplies.
        I read parts of your articles to my dh last night, he said he would check his meds. I told him he need at least a 6 month supply ahead, and he has an appt at the end of this month for the doctor, 3 month check up.
        When your family has worked in the medical field as mine has in some sort of a capacity, and have watch the different bacterial infections that have developed over the last 40+ years, to say it is unnerving is putting it mildly.
        Keep up the great work.

  14. WYO Ryder says:

    Another EXCELLENT post Bam Bam – thanks! I have added more to my shopping list (& yes, cat litter one of them 🙂 Otherwise, we are good for a solid six months or better of confinement if need be. We are so remote up here but you never know. But owning a liquor store opens DH & I to lots of germs, etc…

    After all the talk about carpets & the germs they hold, I am also buying a upgraded vac & am going to shampoo my carpets (usually wait until mud season but….) & I am seriously considering ripping out carpet in a couple rooms & replacing with faux wood flooring.

    Please keep us posted if you here more on H7N9 ? !
    Have fun shopping 🙂

    • WYO Ryder says:

      PS Understanding that preparing before a disaster is prudent & best….I also have an emergency/just before TSHTF shopping list – the one I would run to the store with right before the shelves get emptied….do any of you do this?? I know I would want to grab everything in that situation so have this list to keep me focused.

      • WYO Ryder,

        Oh, this would be a great post. I would love to hear your last minute shopping list.

      • WYo Ryder, I agree with Bam Bam, would love to hear about your last minute shopping list.

    • WYO Rider,
      i would save the money from the purchase of the new cleaners and buy the flooring. The new snap in faux flooring is so easy you can do a couple rooms a day. Even with cutting in around doors and closets. At Home Depot they have the flooring for as low as 1.97 sf.
      I loath carpeting. I holds the nasties like no other. I have washable throw rugs by the beds and in front of the bathtubs and showers. I also spent a few bucks and put a heating mat under the flooring in my bathroom.

      • WYO Ryder says:

        Hello ‘neighbor’ Mama J 🙂
        The closest Home Depot, Lowes, etc is 3.5 hrs away. Will be going to Idaho late next month, get some then. I have decided to experiment with faux-wood in my daughter’s bedroom (aka backup isolation room). Then the next room I’ll do will be the dining room (its small too) and so on. Will shampoo carpets in the meantime (yuck).

        Thanks for the advice 🙂

        PS Bam, a friend just now dropped off one bottle each elderflower tincture and elderberry syrup 🙂

        • Hey Neighbor!
          I feel your pain. The closest Home Depot to me is 2 hours away! The Lowes is 5 hours away. When I go I take a trailer and max out my card. It is great fun. We normally spend 3-4 hours in there, go have lunch, and go back and load. I think they should have a snack bar and a napping area.

        • WYO,

          I bet you could make your own carpet shampoo–mix vinegar and laundry soap.

      • I agree with Mama J. here. I can’t wait to rip out the carpet in my house. I have a vacuum that gets out 99 percent of the allergins in carpet (Rainbow). But I would much rather have tile/wood.

        • Girls, I haven’t had carpet for 15 years and I do not miss it! Get something you can really clean or live on the concrete subfloor. You will be so glad to be rid of that stinky carpet. Your allergies will get better, too.

        • I am lucky in that installing wood floors is what my dh does for a living. The first thing he did when we got this new place was tear out the old floor and put wood down for me. It is so much easier to keep clean. For a homemade cleaner, I do 1 cp rubbing alcohol, 1 cp vinegar, and 1 cp water and about 20 drops essential oil (or I use my infused vinegar). Keeps the floors clean without all the chemicals little ones can absorb crawling around.

  15. I’m gonna run out tonight and get cat litter and some canned food. Got enough dry, I think – like 40 lbs. One thing you can do to fake canned cat food is to pour water on some dry food and wait 5 minutes.

  16. Pennypincher,thanks for your kind interest and tips.I took a basic smithy class 30 yrs back,looking to upgrade my security.
    Sadly it didn t give as much info as I could use.However the Chiltons basic car care says the chain and padlock under the hood,to where you can just get to the lock helps a lot.My Smithy class recommends mose expensive padlocks,like the 20 to 35 buck range ,like masterlock 16.
    I live in a singlewide,12×50 on my own acre.What you were saying about the whole police dept being in on it,I believe thats the case for the whole region.
    Ive been here 22yrs.Some of my aunts are married to detectives,as well as some of their offspring being in law enforcement.One of my uncles is a secret service type,1/2 doz in dads familys in the freemasons,and 1/2 of the masons are law enforcement types.
    My dads family goes back 310 yrs here,my dads granddad was a co sheriff deputy here,he concurrently owned a genl store,5 miles from where I live,pops said they came in 310 yrs back and started a trading post,staying in the genl store business thru that time up til about 1947.
    I think theyre ripping the community off,sabotaging cars to pick them up for nothing,and fixing them up as collectors cars when they can,case of the guard dog turning on the flock and eating the sheep.Mines a T bird,next thing to a mustang…

  17. That was more expensive adlocks like master locks 16 up,some you have to special order.However, a lot of mailmen are detectives as well.
    My ma grew up next to a Powell,that grew up and became a captn in the vice squad.He had a nephew that was a dead ringer for me ,goes around trying to convince everyone that hes a junkie.Hes a auto electric and bodyshop specialist,goes around sireing twins wherever he goes.I heard he was with the Fed Deputy Marshals office.
    I also learned the sabotage on my car was a light in the dash ,once gone can cause the car to not charge,last time in the shop.Had it to 4 mechanics,none of who fixed it til I took it to the local elctric specialist.Have another car thats not charging ,even after replacing alternator,probably same.Had another car station wagon came down the same way.
    Then theres the repair shop making keys while they have it and handing them out to do such dirty work,like you said,in my case.However ,my education says the can cut a key from the vin no,using code books.
    I believe internal affairs needs to be using a voice stress analysis on the employees of all law enforcement depts nationwide.Its standard practice for insuraNCE INVESTIGATORS… That d clear up a lot of crime.Good for the goose,good for the gander…

  18. Ms Bam,
    Well thought out with real level headed thinking.

    You mentioned MN? We’re up here in Frostbite Falls and have not heard of any cases on the radio, as of yet.
    But hey there, ya, you bet ya, we’ll pass on anything we hear, ya know?(For those who do not speak Minnesotan, I said that I will pass on any info)

    O.K. then, who wants to go ice fish’n there?

  19. tommy2rs says:

    For those interested here are a couple of flu tracker pages.

    CDC – Flu Activity & Surveillance

    Flu F.A.C.T.S. – Track the Flu

  20. Thanks Bam Bam,
    Sharing your research and ideas is so helpful. You may save a few of our lives if this gets bad. Take Care.

  21. Sw't Tater says:

    Definitely somethin’ to think ’bout.
    Another good article Bam Bam. We wouldn’t be hungry,but we might not have what we want.Have enough variety to change it up for a while.
    .Meds 2 mybe 3 months would be tough with present needs, could reduce doses and make that…..6 months, not even.
    More Tp. paper plates. as long as electricity and internet for info good.
    EMP not so good, but we are survivors, would make it, though would have to hand carry water for two families.

  22. farmmomwannabe says:

    BamBam, Thank you for wonderful, informative articles and great reminders. Kitty litter was something we hadn’t stored enough of, so added some today. Just an FYI, mountainroseherbs.com must have more elderberries in, as I ordered 4 pounds a couple of hours ago ($11 per lb). They weren’t taking orders Saturday. I have used their products with great results, and have no connection with them other than as a satisfied customer.

    • Thanks for the heads up about Mountain Rose having in more Elderberry. Since I’m currently in OR, I ordered more, and will swing by on our way home on Friday to pick up my order and check out the store.

      • Michele ~ You’ll love Mountain Rose Herbs! They are fantastic!

      • I would love to go to a brick and mortar Mountain Rose store. OMG. That would be the coolest thing. I would get some different teas. I would get herbs. I would get essential oils. Oh, my. I would have fun.

    • farmmomwannabe,

      Thanks for the update on mountainrose herbs, I ordered 4 lbs of elderberries too. I want to be able to make my own tincture or syrup. I feel much more prepared for any flu now!

      • BamBam, Michele, Zee, & gifted others;
        You ladies seem to have the best knowledge that I can locate so far on herbal medicines, teas, and tinctures.
        What book for a beginner would you recommend? I have looked at the books on Amazon, and find very mixed reviews, so you assistance will be greatly appreciated.

  23. Tricia in NC says:

    Ordered Sambucol and a long term food storage order. Made a shopping list I will take care of bit by bit this week. Hurricane season is approaching too — a good reason to top off preps anyway. Thank you for your perspective. I agree.

  24. midnight1st says:

    Thanks so much for the info, Bam Bam. I will head to the store tomorrow to fill in the holes.

  25. Bam Bam, thanks again. I am so worried about this, my dh, bil, and some close friends all work together and they go into other peoples home to work. So my husband is always exposed to who knows what. I dont know how many times my bil came home with one thing or another. If they get exposed and then come home….. my boy tends to sneak in and sleep with daddy most nights, the baby is still nursing so sleeps with us, its nothing for the kids to pass around a glass of water or juice, or when a toothbrush disapears they even tend to share those. I am not a germaphobe, ans my kids are generally really healthy and get over stuff quickly, but without fail if one of us gets sick we all do. I have some stuff, but have serious holes in my preps.
    I know I needed the time to get myself together after moving having a baby and trying to get settled, but taking a year off prepping feels like a huge mistake now.

    • TG,

      I think it’s still a bit early to be worried. There are still no cases outside China. I think it’s important to be prepared. You will know if/when it is time to call the flock home. That is still a ways off.

      • Bam Bam, my dh thinks I could make a career out of worrying. Lol. But at this exact moment I am not stressed about it, which to me is the “know” point.

  26. Suburban Housewife says:

    YIKES! I am not ready! Not ready at all! We are probably pretty close on food and water – but not any of the medical stuff – I hate medical stuff. I laid in bed the other night trying to figure out which room we could use for quarantine – can’t for the life of me figure out where that would work – where we could put up that plastic transition room. we could do the guest room but that is all the way through the house – up the stairs – past all the other rooms to the back – and then if we put up the plastic outside the room it would block off 2 other bedrooms. Fortunately DH and I have good immune systems – never get flu shots, never get the flu and only a rare cold. But he travels a lot- and this flu sounds a bit scary. Crap – I hate medical stuff! Tomorrow I will make a list and order more stuff I guess.

    • Suburban Housewife, I was thinking the same thing. I may just pitch a tent in the yard and have that as my quarantine

    • Suburban Housewife,
      Settle your mind. All will be well.
      If pandemic flu comes it will take priority over EVERYTHING in your life. Pick the room closest to the bathroom and move that person to the guest room temporarily. Or have them bunk up with someone else. Often the master bedroom is the one with the private bathroom. I would give up my room without blinking if I needed to.The kids would give up theres to.
      It just happens that my guest room is one the end of the hall with the bathroom.
      A decent camper would make an good sick room if it has running water and you covered all the upholstery with plastic covers. Removed the curtains. They normally have everything you would need. Hot water, shower, quarantine ready. Electricity, heat, and a stove.

      • Kelekona says:

        Check out the Minimalism movement and their love of “tiny houses.” Basically there are homes so small that they need to be built on trailers to subvert some sort of housing regulation.

        Straw bale construction is a fairly cheap way to make a small separate structure for not a lot. Also check out how to build a small cabin out of reclaimed materials.

        • Interesting you should mention this. I was just thinking about walking out to look at one of my large sheds that I recently emptied into the new shop. I was going to make a play house or studio out of it.
          No reason why it can’t be a quarantine area. A nice day bed and a very small bathroom. Quarantine areas ideally should be separate from the common area.
          I already have the bed, sink, shower pan, and most of the plumbing parts. I would need a toilet, small amount of digging sewer and water lines.
          I have sheetrock and some hickory flooring…sorry..thinking out loud.
          This is a great idea.

      • Suburban Housewife says:

        You are right MamaJ – I do need to settle my mind. It was late and I was tired – normally I am not given to panic. Today I have a whole new out look. The guest bedroom has its own bathroom and it’s probably big enough to create the transition area inside the room at the doorway instead of out in the hall. Problem solved – just extra plastic and tape. Whew!

        I am so envious of you folks that have some yard and land. We live in a compound – Aka planned community housing development with a stupid HOA- and I might be able to find enough yard to put up a single back packers tent – maybe. It’s ridiculous. We live here because my DH felt like its safer when he’s gone. Now that I have learned to shoot – he’s on board with getting some land. Hoping housing market will come up enough that we won’t be quite so upside down and can sell.

        I grew up with travel trailers and summer camping. My DH travels and often gets to stay in the worlds finest hotels. He thinks Holiday Inn is roughing it. I’d love to have a little trailer again.

  27. I would buy more bottled water and top off the gas tank. I already have everything else I need to live without electrical power and under quarantine conditions for at least 6 months while taking sanitary precautions and other measures (gloves, mask, bleach, open carry of the 357…) to deal with any visitors or any mail that shows up on my doorstep.

    • Linda,
      Doesn’t that feel great to be prepared? Great job.

      • Yep. I sleep a whole lot better knowing I don’t have to be part of the crowd of panicked shoppers looking for face masks, medical gloves and other supplies..

    • Linda,

      I would love to get to the point where I feel confident. I am very close. But I keep racking my mind to figure out if there is anything I have missed.

  28. Here’s the morning’s update: 108 infected, 22 dead

    The group of international scientists that landed in China Thursday and not yet determined the source of the virus. Chinese authorities have tested tens of thousands of birds (both domestic and wild) and only a handful have come back positive. There is a confirmed case from another providence in China. The disease is slowly expanding in geographic area. Scientists say to expect additional infections and deaths until the source of the virus is found. There are no confirmed infections outside China.

  29. Here is a very intelligent discussion of what we know and what we don’t know about H7N9.


  30. Here is an excerpt from the link above. (Comments with links have to await moderation. Here’s the important stuff.)


    The avian influenza A(H7N9) virus sequences are reportedly avian but there seem to be differences between Shanghai and Anhui strains and an element that shows adaptation to a human host. Does this mean there is more than one outbreak with perhaps differences in host adaptation or just a reminder of influenzavirus innate instability?

    • Is there any specific serological testing completed, using reliable assays, yet?

    • Do we know whether more instances of mild, or at least non-pneumonia, H7N9 cases occur? We do as of 15th of April.

    • If the virus is not transmissible between humans, how did so many disparate cases occur? Is there an active and massive multi-species avian outbreak occurring from which humans are picking up infections or (?and) are there many mild or subclinical human cases (we now know of 1) that do not meet arbitrary clinical scoring criteria to warrant laboratory testing?

    • Are the 600+ contacts being screened for viral RNA or is clinical “abnormality” solely determined by interview and self-reported illness? Is there proof that the patients are avian influenza A(H7N9) virus RNA negative in order to exclude mild or subclinical infections?

  31. I stumbled across this news story–scientists have identified a new coronavirus circulating in the Middle East and the U.K. So far 17 people have been infected and 11 have died. (SARS was a coronavirus.)

    We have had two novel viruses this month–highly unusual.


    • My goodness, another one?

      So Bam Bam, if out of 17 infected with this novel coronavirus, 11 have died, that’d make the case fatality rate about 65%? The article mentions that the first case of this new disease was in April 2012. . . At least this one seems to be moving slower. . . .

      • Lantana,

        Yes, the new coronavirus has about the same CFR has H5N1–but neither of these have spread rapidly. H7N9 is actually spreading fairly quickly. The “intelligent discussion” article I mentioned earlier raised an important point: how are Chinese authorities determining that close contacts of confirmed cases are okay? Are they doing only phone interviews or are they actually testing them? If there is one asymptomatic person, there are very likely others.

        There are two things I find disturbing: (1) we still don’t have a reliability measure for the test they are using to detect H7N9 (in both birds and humans); and (2) scientists have not found the source of the virus. It is very likely that the test they are using on poultry is not accurate, given the widespread practice of vaccinating poultry in China.

  32. Lauri no e says:

    Bam Bam,

    Thank you, for all your hard work. When I went yesterday to pick up extra bleach, mask, and gloves, I also pick up some extra prepping items the lady in front of me needed me to watch her basket for a minute and when she got back I started talking to her about the flu virus in China and to watch the news. The guy behind me long story short starting making fun of me ohhhh!!! your one of those so what disaster are you preparing for are you a germaphobe? Do you have have lots of guns and a bunker? I said I was concern about the flu virus especially since my husband and daughter work with the public and my husband goes into other people’s homes to work. As I was being mock the thought came through my mind, God tells us to prepare and they also made fun of Noah.

    • Oh my Lauri,
      Sorry that happened to you. What a jerk.
      I would have said something totally horrifying like, “I just found out I have AIDS” and coughed or sneezed right in his face.
      On accident of course.
      When people mock me I lose all my manners.

      • Lauri no e says:

        Mama J,
        You are so funny, you keep me lol all the time. When I see your post I make sure I am not drinking anything. This last winter when I had bronchitis so bad I just about choked to death on the fire evacuation story and the dog and the ammo. I have 4 older brothers and I was the only girl so I can relate to that fire drill story in the middle of the night when the fights would break out with the boys. My husband thought it was funny also since he comes from a family of 4 boys.

        • Lauri,
          Gosh, I am glad ya’ll didn’t choke to death!
          I do aim to please. My life seems ot be such a comedy of errors that it would be a shame not to share it.
          A house full of boys is never boring. That’s for sure!

      • God bless you, Mama J, you are too much fun!

      • WYO Ryder says:

        🙂 too funny Mama J!

    • Lauri, how old was that rude, not-too-bright guy?

      Recently, a 20-something checker at Sams started to put raw meat on top of my strawberries, so I cheerfully asked him to put it where it wouldn’t touch the produce. He then proceeded to wiggle the meat around, putting it close to the strawberries and pulling it back, gasping ‘It’s gonna touch! It’s gonna touch!’ All I could think of to say was, ‘You’ve never had food poisoning, have you?’

      • Lauri no e says:


        That guy was probably in his fifties like me, and I thought I hope you think of me when trouble times come and he is going to wish he had prepared.

        That 20-something idiot that is a lack of respect. There is a difference in being funny and fun and being spiteful. Maybe he will think of you someday when he gets food poison. Sometimes it is the way they were raised or there choice to do the things that they do. When my daughter was about 12 or 13 years old I would start telling her she was accountable for her actions and I was accountable to God how I raised her and when she was about 15 years old one day when she smarted off to me she said I know I know you are accountable to God.
        Long story short now she is in her twenties she is smart and has a great sense of humor like Mama J. All that discipline paid off.

        • Lauri, I seem to recall that we’re in the same general part of the same state–you think your dork might be the father of my idiot?

          Great story about your daughter. . . bet she’ll tell her kids the same thing one day.

          • Lauri no e says:


            lol You never know now days.

            Concerning my daughter she has some funny childhood stories. It makes me feel good when she tells me I was a good mother because as we all know we all make mistakes.

  33. I got to play hookey from school today and finally made it to the “local” (about 50 miles away) health food store to pick up some elderberries. I was able to see what all they have available and have a list for payday… I have a funny feeling the liquor store guy is gonna think I’m an alcoholic before I get done 😉 I decanted a Rosemary tincture and a Peppermint tincture and got them into small 4oz canning jars. I’ve been putting it off, but I feel much better about having those 2 done and the elderberry tincture started.

    • Kelekona says:

      Shandi, it all depends on how much and what you buy. you could always gush about a theme party youre having with flavor hacked vodka. (Learn some fun infusions, but they prolly don’t care.)

      I like the term obscutating stupidity, or the cloak of boring.

    • Lauri no e says:


      I thought of you the other day I was in Sam’s and they had work books for children 1st through 5th grade. It had Math, Science, writing skills (which I need) and more info. I am referring back to one of you post from a couple of weeks ago.

      • 🙂 Cool. We have a Sam’s run scheduled here in the next couple of weeks and I will definitely check to see if they have any. For some reason, I never think of Sam’s when it comes to those things.

    • All the “fun” happens at school when I am off… apparently they administration managed to either run off or fire 2 teachers on my hall effective immediately. Makes me wonder if they’re gonna try for me… Forewarned is forearmed and all that. Plus my state is one of those where recording conversations is legal if 1 party is aware of the recording… so I am going to be taking some precautions between that and having a 3rd party witness to any conversations I have with the powers that be… Less than 5 weeks to the end of school and they’re gonna try this crud… Makes me wonder what their agenda is (or does that sound a little paranoid?)

      • Lauri no e says:


        You are not paranoid. I will keep you in my prayers.

      • Thanks y’all!

      • worrisome says:

        Shandi if the recording thing is legal for one way conversations, go buy yourself a recorder with a good battery and a long tape! And turn the tables on em. Would that help?

      • Shandi:

        FYI, my friend, who was a long time Peace Officer in rural areas, kept a small pocket recorder with him at all times. He was able to use it to prove, in court, whether or not certain things were said. There are many very fine models, try an office supply store, that will record for several hours, have a built in mic, and make no sound themselves.

    • Shandi;
      I laughed so hard and long my dh probably thinks I have lost my mind again. Yes, it is somewhere around here. My dh asked is going to taste as nasty as the stuff his grandmother use to make him drink when he was sick. I smiled and said most likely!

  34. Here is another interesting article–a bird flu expert from Oxford University says it’s only a matter of time before we see a case of H7N9 outside mainland China.


    • BamBam;
      You definitely gave me some reading to do this evening. I saved all the articles so that I could take my time reading, as I always get interrupted in the middle of my projects.

  35. Morning Update: First case of H7N9 has been identified outside mainland China. Taiwan reports its first case. The mainstream media is now picking up the story. WHO has described it as one of the most lethal viruses they have seen in years.

    • Bam Bam,

      I was reviewing the info on making the shelf-stable (years) Elderberry syrup from your Part 2 Flu article which called for 100 proof vodka. The recipe was from the hungry mouse after his original post..

      The regular syrup called for 13 cups of water and 4 cups of raw honey. The shelf stable version called for 12 cups of 100 proof vodka. So, do you use both 13 cups of water and 12 cups of vodka, or replace the water with vodka? I am new to making herbal tinctures/syrups and was unsure.

      Also, do you know a good place/site to purchase the N95 respirator masks?

      Thank you for your focus and diligence on this flu!

      • Hannah,

        The tincture and the syrup are totally different. The tincture is made from 100 proof vodka and elderberries (no water). The syrup is made with water (and no vodka). To make the tincture, just fill a canning jar 1/3 of the way with dry elderberries. Then fill the canning jar with vodka.

  36. Congrats,Bam Bam, on winning with these entries on the flu and what to do…
    Another helpful link to write down is http://www.webmd.com

    One of the No 1 Books on the market for natural health I have in my home bookshelf is”Prescription For Nutritional Healing”,by Balch ,CNC,and Balch,MD.Avery pub,co.,Ive the 3rd ed,$23.95 trade paperback,big as a phonebook,776pg..It says its America s no 1 guide to natural health.It also lists everything Ive said in these comments for the flu…

    • khbostic,

      Prescription for Nutritional Healing is a great book. I highly recommend this book.

  37. Sorry that link didnt work,its http://www.rustybayonet.com then at bottom it says survival kit lists,clic there or ,http://www.rustybayonet.com/survival_info.html

  38. Case in Taiwan

    A 53 year old man who had recently traveled to China is in critical condition. He has had contact with more than 100 people. Taiwan is testing these contacts for the virus. There are three health care workers who were exposed. So far they show no signs of illness. But they are going to test them anyway. We will get a straight answer (probably by the end of the day) on whether the virus spreads person-to-person.

    The problem in China is that we don’t know if they actually tested the close contacts or whether they just called them to see if they had symptoms.

    Authorities in Taiwan reported several days ago they had developed a test that only takes 2 and a half hours. I place a lot more trust in Taiwan officials than Chinese officials–especially after the daughter of one of the men in critical condition barged in on a TV interview because she was not allowed to see her dad and had no information on his condition.

  39. Here is an excerpt from a Fox News report.


    The CDC received another sample of the virus from China this week, and Mike Shaw, who works at the CDC’s flu lab, said they found certain mutations of the virus, which had they mutated further, would have been rendered ineffective against antivirals, like Tamiful and Relenza.

    Dr. Joseph Bresee, a flu expert at the CDC, said it is possible the flu is being transmitted from person to person, but it’s not yet been 100 percent confirmed.

    End Quote

    This is exactly news stories evolve. First, they report there is no evidence of person to person transmission. Then they report there is no confirmed cases of person to person transmission. Then they say they cannot rule out person to person transmission. Then they say person to person transmission is sporadic. Now they are saying it is possible it is being transmitted from person to person–but they are still not 100 percent sure.

    • “they found certain mutations of the virus, which had they mutated further, would have been rendered ineffective against antivirals, like Tamiflu or Relenza.”

      What are they trying to say here–that the further mutations would have rendered antivirals ineffective? Or that the further mutations would have rendered the virus impotent against treatment by antivirals?

      As written, it sounds like the CDC’s focused on defeating that scourge upon humanity, antivirals. Which sounds preposterous. . . but then, so do a lot of the projects that the gov’t gives taxpayer-funded grants for.

    • And “possible, but still not 100% sure” sounds like what you say when you mean “probably” but PR or Legal doesn’t want you to say “probably”.

  40. Another key piece of information: CDC says isolation time is 10 days. (If H7N9 develops into a pandemic, you should keep people isolation for a minimum of 10 days before they are permitted to mix with your group.)


  41. The three hospital staff who came into contact with H7N9 case in Taiwan show symptoms of respiratory illness.

  42. Oh,and a couple days ago I mentioned the neighbor boy that grew up next door to my mom became the vice squad captain.That he had a nephew that was my evil twin type that went around trying to convince everyone he was a Junkie.When in fact he was a plainclothes type,who specialized in bodyshop and auto electric.Years down the line I heard he carried a Fed Deputy Marshal badge.

    I had to come back and clarify,Ive had dozens in law enforcement that could pass as my double,at least 50% match on computer match program . http://www.myheritage.com is a place they have such a program,and its free.\

    My mom ,I asked about it,she said its like the droopy cartoon on woody woodpecker and friends.Droopy is a beagle,and beagles are hard to tell one from the other a lot of times.Now,the police are hiring a lot of detectives that are deliberately look alikes as a specialty routine,after having that kind of problem with blacks,no fooling.

    Oh,and to make matters worse,my dad was sterile and they wanted kids,so she and he decided for her had them by someone else,as my moms mom was a genius type with a education major….

  43. Ps,and the plainclothes nephew of the vice squad captain was actually the son of a doctor.The vice squad catain did the backyard mechanic thing a number of years,before going postal,ie ,postal delivery man,in all seriousness.
    Also,my mom was a Sate Nurse in the Geriatric division,nightshift, a few yrs,befor going to work at the police dept for 14 yrs…

  44. Here is an interesting article on the new coronavirus.


  45. Lab Tech says:

    What was almost as interesting as the article on the new coronavirus was some of the comments! These people really do like to keep their head in the sand. Numerous posts about how the scientists are trying to scare the public and that the pharmaceutical companies are cashing in to make a buck. Apparently those readers don’t understand how viruses mutate, or maybe don’t care. Wow.

    • Lab Tech;
      Whom are you referring to when mentioning heads in the sand??
      Could you please be more specific.

      • Becky,

        Lab Tech is talking about the comments on the new coronavirus paper–people who think virologists are just out to scare people to improve their funding. (He was not being mean to anyone here.)

        The fact of the matter is that we have two known viruses that could cause pandemics. And WHO is having a hard time allocating resources to keep track of both. H7N9 has infected and killed more people a lot quicker; however, the new coronavirus appears to spread more easily between humans, and it has impacted a wider geographic area–UK and the Middle East. And it has a higher case fatality rate.

    • Lab Tech,

      What folks have not fully appreciated is that H7N9 is mutating rapidly. And when viruses mutate, they tend to get more lethal. As the WHO has said, this is truly an evolving situation.

  46. Bam Bam, thank you so much for keeping us updated on this.

  47. The thing I hear is 23% of the U S population is pos for at least Herpes simplex,the cold sore type of thing.But like the flu virus mutates,the simplex could mutate and become the more serious forms of herpes.
    Around here ,they ve been passing around the Shingles to each other,thats what Ive heard for the past ten yrs..A virus stays with you for life,you can help to keep it dormant though.
    Sexually transmitted diseases come like baskin and robbis ice cream.28 different varieties ,more or less.
    Then theres like 4 different hepatitis variations as a virus.
    I was reading about a virus that attacks the heart and blood vessels,usually killing the pt in 2 yrs,maybe it was a corona virus.

    Polio was one of the best known viruses,poliomyelitis.FDR had that.Seems it has some things in common with MS,symptomatically,as well as polymyositis.
    The legioaires disease was spread from the air conditioner ducts in vegas,so thats a good place to spray lysol type disinfectants,air ducts,even in vehicles,jets,etc,for anything infective.
    How bout those barrier contraceptives,no glove ,no love sayings like surgeon genl Jocelyn Elders got the boot for promulgating…

  48. For sports and mental performance a amino l arginine is used to be a vaso dilator,giving the pump.However ,it is written arginine feeds viruses

    So to counter this, if one is going to use arginine,which also helps sex blood flow,Drs recommend 1000mg of l lysine be used with it,as l lysine,another amino ,suppresses replication of viruses.
    So maybe this is why some folks have erectile dysfunction and vascular troubles as a contributing factor…

    • PJ,

      Thanks for posting the link. I couldn’t make sense of the reports on the case from Taiwan–no one was giving exact dates. Now it makes sense that the man got sick April 12.

      China hasn’t reported any new cases in the last 48 hours. They say they’ve identified the source (live chickens butchered in market). But this does not make sense either. Chinese authorities have said they’ve found only a handful of positive cases in poultry from poultry farms. They’ve shut down the chicken markets. (In China, to get dinner you go pick a live chicken and it’s butchered on the spot. Then you carry it home and cook it.) Here’s what doesn’t make sense: if the chicken’s didn’t have the virus when they left the chicken farms but they had the virus when at the market, where did the chickens get the virus? There has to be an intermediary host–something at the market that keeps infecting the birds.

      This fact and the fact that almost half the confirmed cases had no contact with poultry is puzzling. My suspicion is that there are a lot more cases (mild cases) and people don’t want to go to the hospital. (In China, if you die and rack up medical costs, those debts are transferred to your children.)

      One thing is clear: The CFR will increase significantly. There are an estimated 70 people (mostly elderly men) who have been in critical condition for weeks now. As they die off, the CFR will go from 20 percent upwards to 70 percent.

  49. In my health and longlife pages,that went with my 4,5 ,or 6 leaf clover sales as well as talisman sets,I said viruses are killed by a strong stun gun type current of electricity.

    I sent 2/3 rds of my $3.7 million dollars worth of stock,saying this.As well as ,they could do a chamber that isolates a quantity of blood on a dialysis machine to do this without shocking the patient ,even as a treatment that would go a long ways for the AIDs pts.

    Also for making the whole blood supply safe,it could be exposed to the stun gun type of current to kill any virus that may be lurking therein,over the past 33 yrs,honest to God….

  50. ie,that is,I sent the 2/3rds of my stock/$3.7 million worth, to the Am Red Cross HQ,in Falls Church ,VA,what Ive done with my life,on a pension…

  51. In the big black book of secrets,boardroom classic publishers,it says its legal to import no more than a 90 day supply of meds.

    Down in Mexico,a years supply of AIDs treatment meds costs 500 bucks while here in the US of A,it costs 30 grand for the very same thing.
    Under Obama care,shouldn t they give such pts a all expence pd medical vacation,wouldn t that save apx 24 grand a yr?But surendipitously,the AIDs drugs can be used on superviral strains such as in this discussion,scientific generalization,as a universal principle…

  52. Grumpy Vermonter says:

    Masks, check. Gloves, hmmm, need more. Bleach, tinctures and the rest I really need to get serious about. Bam Bam, thanks for the heads up as always, and for the links. I’m going to get that mucus stuff for hubby, who has asthma as well. Need more kitty food and litter as well.
    On another note, just wanted to say Thank You for anyone who included us in their prayers for a possible job in S.D. for hubby. He got a call this evening, just as my sister was over helping me put up an extension ladder so I could replace the peak of the trailer back that had fallen down from the wind today. If they like him, they’ll call again. If I could ask again for prayers? Kind of confusing, wondering what to do right now, so I guess for God’s direction to be made very clear would be great. We just found a great church right close by, which was a huge surprise and happened so oddly. then hubby got the call today. They’re adding yet another tax in our state – a 7 cent gas tax. We are so taxed it’s not funny anymore.

    • Grumpy,

      We will keep you and your dh in our prayers. Make sure you get the generic of Mucinex–it’s a lot cheaper.

      • Grumpy Vermonter says:

        Thank you, Bam Bam. And I added the Kirkland Mucinex you linked on Amazon on my “wish list” there so I can get back to order it easily. Really appreciate the prayers!

  53. Chinese authorities have not announced any new cases in the last 48 hours. That’s not because they have the situation under control; it’s because they have decided to report on new cases weekly and not daily.


    As of Wednesday, information on the H7N9 cases in China will be publicized on a weekly basis, said the commission.

  54. Flu Trackers has boots on the ground in China. The web translation is not very good. I sure wish someone in the Pack could read Mandarin. But here’s one report. At one hospital it looks like they have set up triage for flu patients. They are reusing thermometers, sterilizing them with bleach. They are putting face masks on patients in the waiting room.


  55. I was out repairing my front porch this morning myself.Had to cut out part of a deck planck and replace it with new one,It was 20 yrs old,and a lot better than replacing all of the planks.I think that one came from the lumber yard infected,cause they were pressure treated deck planks.
    Try using screws and liquid nails,it comes in a caulk tube for roof repair.I did a roof repair on my 14 x 24 garage,with a 2×3 ft strip cut from roll roofing,and patched it over the leak with 5 gal pail of asphalt roofing cement ,runs apx 30 to 40 bucks,while a 3×35 ft roll of roll asphalt runs apx 35 bucks at builders supply like home depot or lowes.com

    I buttered the patch under and around the edges on top,feathered it out with a putty knife,hint ,hint,Grumpy Vermonter,you could use roofing nails,but screws probably work better on metal roof,just butter over with asphalt roofing tar..

    • Grumpy Vermonter says:

      Khbostic, it actually was the peak part of our vinyl siding that blew off, leaving the gable end wide open. On trailers of this vintage, it seems that they didn’t think sheathing was necessary! I shined a flashlight in there and could feel the warm air hitting me in the face. Our rafters are 2×2’s – real quality there – NOT! This place is moldy, the floor is caving in here and there, the steel frame underneath is angled on the long sides, so you can’t put anything under it to support and keep the long sides from sagging down, the windows are rotten, the walls are rotten and well, the list just keeps growing. I keep kicking myself for not taking the day off from work when the so-called home inspection was done on this place, as the “home inspector” didn’t mention most of this. It’s just not worth our while to keep pouring money into this pit, given that the supporting steel base is so poorly designed. I don’t believe they make trailer bases like this anymore, where your joists run the length of the place – at least I hope they don’t! Then the dryer died last week, just as we were thinking we might be able to afford a steel shed to replace the soggy spider box out there that is slowly sinking into the ground. Right about the same time the dryer died, we got a notice in the mail from the state, who owns this park, that all oil tanks now are required to be on cement pads, with roofs over them or the fuel companies won’t be able to fill them legally this year. Our tank is on it’s last legs and the quote I got from the fuel company was anywhere from 1000 to 1200 for the tank alone, not to mention the pad and the roof and the labor to unfill the old tank and remove it and install the new tank. I could do the roof for the tank, but the materials cost is even a concern right now. The place the tank needs to be is right near where the electrical service comes up from underground, so I wouldn’t be comfortable digging deep enough there to make a frost proof pad to suit the state. Due to the shed crumbling and the dryer dying, our fund for a woodstove so we could sidestep the furnace/oil tank fiasco is drying up. Just as I’m selling a few things on ebay and making a little bit to put towards all this, they start looking at an Internet Tax!

      At this point (and yes, I know I’m whining) I might actually be happy if the EPA came and declared our site a wetland due to the runoff from the huge hill smack behind us, as the little stream running under and beside our place right now is making it boggy and moldy here. I am getting the feeling that we are being squeezed in from all sides on purpose, but yep sure could use some prayers so we know just exactly what that might be!
      And lest you all think I do nothing but whine I have to say the winter-sowing in containers has worked pretty well so far. I have a lot of strong, healthy seedlings out on our deck/porch that make me smile. Nothing like seedlings to lift my spirits – that, and our daffodils are blooming! If I successfully get these into the ground, I will do a write-up for you all on how to do it in a zone 4b area or colder, if there’s interest.

      • I would probably get some o s b ,it comes 5/8 inch thick as well as 3/4 in thicknesses,in a 4×8 ft sheet.I would then measure where you say the arch blew out in a high wind,and cut to fit in there,measre how long by how hi.
        I d maybe back it with som 2×4 pieces for a frame to attach it to,then fill it in with liquid nail product in a caulk gun.6 bucks buys a can of styrofoam spray,apx 10 oz,that you spray around it to create a dead air space,it hardens in 24 hrs,you can trim with a razor knife/boxcutter ,if excess.
        25 bucks buys a jig saw at most big box stores to do the repair.Builders supply storsselldrill bits with screwdriver attaCHMENTS FOR DRIVING SCREWS IN WITH REVERSABLE DRILL,WITH CORD COSTS APX 23 BUCKS,NEEDS 50 FT EXT CORD.THEN YOU CAN SCREW THE OLD SIDING BACK ON,OR BUY MEASURE ,AND CUT NEW SIDING.

  56. As for jobs,every state has a fed funded Employment Security Comission office im most every county.Like yours would be just put Vermont Employment Security Commission ,dial 411,ask for their no.
    They have computerized job banks to search,also you could look on out of state job bank for S Dakota as well there.
    You say your husband has asthma,my maternal grandmas sister had it,and had to get off the wheatfarm they were raised on in Ontario,85 mi east of Detroit.
    My great aunt took over the head bookkeepers job from my grandma,when she left to open a ma and pa restaurant with my grandpa.My great aunt retired from the job,at Ludington News Co in Detroit around 1973,and they d just started automating.They took expired magazines,and comics off shelves,ripped front covers off and repacked as pkg deals to put back on shelves.
    Hay was one of asthmas triggers for my great aunt.Theres lots of wheat grown in S Dakota,hay is better qualityfrom wheatstraw.Never heard what line your hubbie is in.Also see http://www.ask.com,then type in jobfind then name of your area…besides employment office,classified ads in local papers…

    • Grumpy Vermonter says:

      khbostic, thanks for the info about the wheat. It’s mold that really sets hubby off, and guess what we’ve got in spades here 🙂 His line of work is called maintenance technician, which is a fancy way of saying he has the know-how to work on semiconductor fab machines and does the trouble shooting for same. He applied for a job as a process tech. out there, which he thinks he’s qualified for and could reasonable do.

      • The thing of mold is that its endemic throughout the snowbelt.So,you would probably find it in S Dakota as well.We had it in Michigan when I was a kid,my uncle had it in the Tennessee mountains where he worked for Texas Instruments,that changed hands to Siemens.He ha a couple creeks around his house,with a unfinished basement,he put down the builders plastic down there.
        He asked me what kills it,I had a set of encyclopedias that said :Tri Sodium Phosphate,found at hardware stores.I also told him a space heater in the basement would help draw moisture out of the air and make the place drier,the heat would just rise so it wouldn t be wasted.
        My older brother got a electric solid state t v repair 1 yr tech rating in the early 70s.E I T /electronics institute of tech had a placement service along with their program,ended up moving to California,where theres a lot of that kind of work,but 1/2 the students dropped out,as it was too demanding.
        On your windows ,use regular caulk around window frames,I ve touched up mine with clear paintspray for a weater barrier too.On inside I place plastic sheets with tape ,and keep it there all yr round.If sills are gone measure and cut and just put it over whatevers left.I also sealed windows shut with caulk as I have a window air conditioner,75% have one these days.
        I have to warn you,smoke from woodstoves, is also a trigger for asthma.My aunt had heavy vinyl plastic clear slipcovers on her chairs ,beds,sofas ,so as not to stir up the dust,another trigger,and did the same for her car.So once again the 4 mil black plastic comes in a 100 ft roll ,you unfold it and place under the home for a vapor barrier.The builders supply store usually sells repair books,as well as books on how to build a outbuilding like a multi car garage,maybe look at http://www.lowes.com or http://www.homedepot.com etc

  57. More prayers here for you all, GV. . . .

  58. http://www.nothingbutsoftware.com has 3 resume programs,just went thereto look it up,not to o bust again.$ 11 to 15 buck price range.just type in seach box resume software ,once there if wanting it.
    http://www.officemax.com might have diverse software progams as well.
    Back when I was at comm college in late70s,they had a work study program ,where you could just take a couple classes,and work maybe 20 hr s a week,ask by calling guidence counsellor at community college whereever you are,if interested.

    Some churches here an there,have building companies,you might ask if they have something like that ,if building constructions your thing,or join the freemasons lodge,and or call them to see if anyones hiring.Some hang out in front of the employment office,to see if anyone comes by looking for day laborers.
    Most major cities have manpower temperary employment agencies,which amounts to day labor.I had a aunt by marriage that used towork in a office like manpower,without the franchise name.She died a few yrs back..

  59. http://www.thedailysheeple.com is running a story right now,asking is human to human contact now happening with the china bird flu,citing its spread from china to taiwan.

    I was thinking,instead of veggies in ball mason quart jars,the meat would be worth 3 times as much in those jars.I never learned how myself,but my dads sisters all canned veggies from the garden.

    My dad couldn t get a job teaching in S FL,so he went to work for the Singer Sewing machine franchise.They brought in a quarter million cuban refugees.They started to do cottage industry piece work for the garment industry.So they bought lots of stuff at the singer sewing machine store,cloth,sewing machines etc.They d ship 18 wheelers full up to the new york garment industry,Pants,Dresses,Skirts,Blouses,undies,etc..Former millionaires,disposessed out of Cuba…

  60. Going for the stretch here,spread the word,Generally,for Vermont,and rural New England,I d say the sugar beets for sugar is a great cash crop.I watched a documentay on modern marvels
    .It said the secret is to process the sugar beets the same day theyre dug up and harvested.Like corn,the sugar turns to starch,the longer its not processed.1/2 of America s table sugar comes from beets these dys.Whats left over after the sugar is extracted is turned into animal feed at stockyards,to fatten them up before the animals are processed.
    Even ptatoes can be fed to animals,5 to 8 weeks before being processed.
    Both can be turned into gasohol,which doesn t work well in cold weather,so its best used the warm 6 mo out of the year…So,gasohol co ops as well,from this for New England s economice wellbeing…

    • Grumpy Vermonter says:

      khbostic, Vermont’s Champlain Valley used to be known as The Breadbasket of the East. Looking at it now, you’d never believe it. Macmansions and development sprawl all over it, but under all that is really good soil. There was a bit of back and forth about outsiders from other states bringing all their crap with them into their new paradise and how the person was upset by that. To some extent, I believe that is true in every state. We certainly have it here. The people doing the changing think they are doing great things, too. At some point you just have to laugh about it, because getting upset doesn’t do anything but spread yet more ill will and we don’t need any more of That in the world just now!

  61. I get a catalog from http://www.henryfields.com and it sells elderberry potted plats for 19.99 ea.in york and nova type.Says it grows 12 to 14 feet,but I didn t have any luck with it here some yrs back.

    The best luck Ive had is going to wallyworld and getting tomato 6 packs with some liquid fertilizer like miracle grow.However,Im on a shallow 3 ft wide by 25 ft deep well,so I didn t want to wear my well out,after doing it the first 6 yrs i was here,planting lawn,trees ,and s.privet hedge.I put in a doz pecan trees,there was already a few when I bought my lot.Im trying to grow shade and a nw windbreak on my 1 acre lot,with a 12×50.
    I put up the 14×24 garage,and 8 x 12 front porch/started as a deck /landing,then I added a roof over it about 18 ft on roof.
    I then added a 8×8 landing at back door,maybe I ll add a roof to that.
    This may be the way to go for the 20% babyboomers that are at retirement age right now,another hint.
    I told the red cross,that 75% of New Englanders are heating with oil at apx 4500 a yr for avg home.For luck,I said tell them to install multiple natural gas space heaters to save 1/2 on heating bills,also with electric space heaters like the quartz infrared 5000 btu units,in multiples.Propane costs a lot more than natural gas.
    Heres some genius:using natural gas space heaters and using natural gas in the big 300 lb tanks,trucking natural gas in,instead of the higher cost of propane,as a new industry.

  62. I was a member of the AARP a few yrs.However,they put you on mailing lists that send you insurance ads /spam all the time in your regular postal delivery.

    They have a website at http://www.aarp.org I believe.I mention this as sometimes they help with employment of older workers.Its about twice as hard getting a job after youre 55 yrs old plus.
    On my 4 leaf clovers,I saw a ad in the signals catalog yrs ago charging apx 28 bucks for one in a frame,postpaid.

    Then I wanted do give some extra value so I developed my health and longlife resource pages with many resources for them to save the price of the clover,if they needed stuff the resources sold.

    That was besides some of the grtst hits of alternativemedicine/natural health.I lised resource of bookclubs that give a hundred to 200 bucks in books with club membership,as a instant rebate kin of thing,hows that for luck?

  63. http://www.shtfplan.com headline yesterday said: authorities should definately get ready for a worst case scenario,concerning this bird flu strain..
    Personally,I feel the symptomatic treatment for upper respiratory distress in elderly could make the difference of life and death,same for pneumonia,of which these are symptoms that go with the flu.

    Here in N Carolina,the primatene mist is a epinephrine inhaler for symptomatic relief of respiratory distress,it ot pulled from the shelves and banned,wouldve been helpful.After it wears off,i can cause a severe temple headache,relieved by a antihistamine cold capsule.

    http://www.swansonvitamins.com carries a condition specific formula called lung specifics,that might be good in this area.What I do have in reserve is the cordeceps musroom,but when it wearsoff,it can cause rebound respiratory distress by itself,be advised.

  64. There’s an important new development with H7N9. The CDC has updated its testing protocols on H7N9 testing. Throat swabs appear ineffective in detecting the virus. The man in Taiwan was tested twice using throat swabs and both tests came back negative. The infection was confirmed with sputum specimen testing. The Chinese CDC ruled out person-to-person transmission because throat swabs came back negative. This is both good and bad news. It is bad news because there are likely hundreds of more cases of H7N9. It is good news because it suggest there are clinically mild cases that did not require hospitalization–hence, the virus may not be as lethal as initially thought.

    I will post the link in a separate comment so this gets posted immediately.

  65. Why would they recommend throat swabs to test for the flu? Seasonal flu tests have always been nasal swabs or a nasal wash.

  66. My dh had some friends over tonight. One of the guys spit in my driveway and I had to go off on him. I figured I would pass on the info here, when people spit on the ground and it gets walked thru, those germs can easily be brought into the house. Sounds kind of weird but I enforce a no spitting zone around my house, especially since the guys tend not to take their shoes off at the door.

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