Questions and answers with The Wolf Pack : Why invest in Gold and Silver?

 Questions and answers with The Wolf Pack : Why invest in Gold and Silver?

I have been told to invest in gold due to the dollar losing value. I would like your opinion….

If I invest in gold, and everybody else around me has had their dollars devalued, who is going to want to buy my gold? When people are starving or wet and cold, a few bricks of gold to lug around and to have to keep someone from stealing it, doesn’t sound like a good option.. Am I just thinking too extreme?

From what I understand, anybody with money will be set up in the underground bunker city made by our government. I just can’t see that my gold is going to be in demand when people don’t have food to eat. Maybe I should invest in seeds! Not that I really have any better ideas, just was wondering what your thoughts were.

Thanks, Blair

M.D. replies : Blair, it depends on the type of collapse, depth and the duration – investing in some gold and silver as a hedge against a collapsing dollar is recommended (would you rather have a pocket full of paper currency or silver / gold when that paper currency has absolutely no value or buying power?) But gold and silver isn’t the end of prepping for an economic collapse, or even where you should start.

I suggest that you get all of your other emergency preps in order – first buy enough land where you can raise a garden and become more self-reliant, pay off your debt,  secure a water source, build your food storage, defense,  survival gear etc., before considering investing in cold / silver and then don’t go overboard. I suggest no more than $5,000 in cash (smaller bills are advisable for exchange) and another $5,000 in silver / gold at current values. Also put back $500 to $1,000 in coinage – preferably Nickels.

Comments

  1. axelsteve says:

    I would buy gold and silver if I could afford it.gold is still a fiat currency though. It is governments who set the price of what gold is worth.Gold will always be worth something unlike paper currency though.

    • tommy2rs says:

      Worst comes to worst paper currency will still have value as toilet paper. ;)

    • No, Gold is not a fiat currency. It isn’t fiat and it isn’t a currency. This subject is confusing enough. Please don’t add to it if you don’t know what you are talking about. Go to hiddensecretsofmoney.com for some good videos that explain it pretty well.

      • HJ is correct. Gold is not even necessarily considered to be money; but, a store of wealth. Money, fiat or otherwise, is a form of liquid barter. Persons from that of a small group of individuals, to a region, country, or the entire world, decide on that value, and what it represents, and using it allows persons to trade without always having what the other person needs. Paper money, even when not backed by gold or other PM’s is perfectly valid, as long as that in circulation represents roughly the actual wealth, as in productivity of the region using it. The problem with our current fiat currency, is that the government has been creating it faster than the productivity of the country has grown, making the productivity worth more per dollar, or conversely, the dollar worth less. This country’s biggest economic problem lies in creation of too much money, too many unfunded promises (liabilities), and government regulations and taxes that farther inhibit the growth in productivity. In short, a greedy and incompetent government sector, filled with self ingraciating fools, elected by what sometimes appears to be bigger fools.

  2. Lord Snow says:

    While I do invest in some gold and silver, I do so knowing that it will only be useful in very specific scenarios. Generally I believe that it would be handy in short term economic downturns. Anything long term or massive in scale (EMP, Plague, etc) would find precious metals taking a back seat to clean water and food.

    • Hi Lord Snow, ” Anything long term or massive in scale (EMP, Plague, etc) would find precious metals taking a back seat to clean water and food.”

      I agree for the term of the problem…at least up to a point…but I think of precious metals as a means of getting some wealth through such a crisis, not just providing wealth during the crisis.

      Even during a long term major crisis, efficient trade requires a medium of exchange. If you have apples to trade and I have fish, but you don’t want my magnificent fish, we both have a problem. If I can sell my fish for silver coins to the guy around the corner and you are willing to take silver coins because you know that the guy selling the jar of honey you want will take silver coins, all four of us benefit. Otherwise doing a four way trade is really cumbersome.

      Another benefit of coins is that they are both portable and long lasting. My utterly delicious fish may not be so great late this August afternoon, and can’t be carried any long distance without ice, and your apples are tough to transport very far, even if they last longer than fish.

      Coins let us sell at one market, and buy a few days later at another.

      There is good reason that once coins were invented, they spread rapidly: they make economic exchanges a lot more efficient.

      Barter economies (where everyone barters stuff for stuff, all the time, rather than now and then for a few things) are very inefficient, and by their nature impoverished. Coinage increases economic efficiency, and makes nearly everyone better off.

      • Penrod

        I’ve never heard anyone explain it better. Besides, it is shiny…

        • Thanks, Harry!

          “Besides, it is shiny…”

          And therein lies part of it’s appeal. Silver and gold appeal to us for silverware and jewelry because it is not only a store of value, but because it is pretty. When times are tough, you can sell the tableware and the jewelry, melt it down and make something else out of it.

          Way back when, the Hall of Mirrors at the Palace of Versailles had furniture made out of solid silver. Tables, chairs, andirons, all sorts of stuff. During tough times Louis the Whatever had it all melted down and turned into coins with which to pay the troops.

          For thousands of years, people have been burying the silverware in the garden or dropping it down the well as the bad guys advanced. We know that because we are still digging up hoards of silver and gold all over Europe. Some people got back to their stash, and some didn’t.

      • Penrod,
        As I mentioned above (before reading this), currency is a form of liquid barter, and accomplishes exactly what you described.

  3. Blair, MD is right on. Get your land, water, food, defense, & other prepper gear in order first. Having some extra seeds is a good idea too. Then keep some US currency, & some in silver & gold. Personally, I like to keep more in silver than gold, b/c I believe silver is going to be easier to trade with. & in an economic collapse, u probably won’t be selling your precious metals for US dollars; u’ll be trading it for something of equal value -seeds, bicycle, etc. You probably won’t be able to get food for it, b/c few if anyone will have food to trade for anything. But u may be able to trade precious metals for fuel to run your tiller.

  4. Per Hiero Desteen says:

    Good answer, MD. If one has their beans, bullets and band-aids squared away, gold and silver are good choices for long term. I wish I could buy some, but still working on the other three. I do have a little silver my mother gave me, not much, but better than nothing, I guess.

  5. Donna in MN says:

    I agree with MD to start with food storage and supplies first, then get some pms. If there is a collapse of the dollar, there will probably be chaos for survival items first. If prolinged, I believe pms will come into play once order and a trade system is established, on what they will buy.

    • Brearbear says:

      I agree.

      Have/get/keep LOTS of preps.

      Cache your preps.

      Have/save/hide all your gold and silver…for EATING…later.

  6. Rude_Dog says:

    In a SHTF situation, gold and silver will just be a way of bartering when one side has no items the other needs but the recipient of the precious metal can then trade to a third party at a later time to get what he wishes. Values will be all set by the going rates at the time of the trade. Initially PM’s might be very high and then come down, no one can predict. Like M.D. said PM’s are not a place to start prepping. PM’s can and have been a place to hedge against inflation before a SHTF situation though. Hard goods are almost always better than paper, unless you need a fire starter. Hard goods can be food, land, seeds, other barter items, tools and even skills someone may need. These are just my take on PM’s but they are not the end all be all.

  7. Petticoat Prepper says:

    Gold is out of my range but I did buy some silver with Christmas gift money. My thoughts are that it wasn’t a huge investment and will most likely be worth more when I’m gone so my DD will be able to sell those coins. If however, the SHTF it might be enough to pay property taxes to hang onto my dirt.

  8. Tom The Tinker says:

    Blair: My 2 cents worth. Your tone tends to sound like you are against PMs form the onset. I for one am not certain what there would be… to be apposed to ownership. PMs are no different from other preps we keep for the same reasons. MD has the right of it in that all our other preparations should be in order before dropping major or even minor money into PMs.

    Gold and Silver are a store of value. The ‘paper’ cost of them do not reflect the true store of value. The markets reflect only the electronic.. paper value that has been manipulated for a given item at that moment in the trading day. As to lugging around bars of gold…. would that I had the sort of liquid assets to own ‘bars’ of gold.

    Take a look at the long graphs of the dollar index and the DJW against the ‘paper’ price of gold and silver. Zoooks adjust the value of a “Cartwheel”.. silver dollar against the paper dollar and see what its value is… (average about 5% per year min.) At ‘Kitco’ $19.92 X .5 compounded X 43 years = !Gasp! And that is using current ‘paper’ value which is the only way to currently access COST of PMs… not intrinsic VALUE of PMS!

    Getting a lot for 2 Cents……. I take our end of the month loose cash and buy minted silver coin. It seems a better idea than another Movie at the mall or lunch at Denny’s and (it hurts to say) another ‘Gun’. My Preps are kept as up to date and my skill search never ends … but I get far more peace and calm from a small handful of Silver dimes and quarters than I ever do from a good long 3 octav Burp after hash and eggs at brunch.

    Oh…. my 2 cents! they are pre-1982 copper!

    • TTT,
      Out of curiousity, where do you find & purchase your pre-64 minted silver coins, and what kind of premium do you pay over spot?

      For those in the pack who want to know the spot price for minted silver coins, see “United States Circulated Silver Coin Values – Updated Every Minute” @ http://www.coinflation.com

  9. JP in MT says:

    Our position on gold and silver is that it is a way to preserve wealth. It does not take president over goods necessary for survival. It is part of a long term balanced approach.

    Our PM’s are a very small part of our preps. As my ability to buy preps diminished, mostly due to inflation, I have less of a “need” for them. However, my opinion is that gold and silver are being held low.

    If you have the additional resources to invest, I would. But beans, bullets, and band aids take precedence at our house.

  10. I buy nether gold or silver. My way of thinking is I can use them as well as I can stored food . If I have excess food stored and there is a crisis I can always take in your metals for my food with food being at a premium . The down side is that gold and silver are much more portable commodities . I do on the other hand keep any silver change I get , rare now but does happen . I also keep and wheat pennies that cross my path.

  11. mom of three says:

    I save my nickles, pre 2013, and we have a nice amount. I use to buy them at the bank, but they always asked what I was doing with them, now I just collect them from our change. We have some silver, it good to have a bit. Gold, way out of my price range.

  12. Exile1981 says:

    Buy lead, it’s currently cheaper than gold or silver, the last of the primary producers is closing in the US this summer and it has a lot more basic uses than gold or silver.

    • Be careful of how and where you store lead though, it is very toxic, especially in commodity amounts. If it gets wet it can poison soil and ground water, and any impacts can put particles of lead and lead oxides into the air, potentially (over time) causing respiratory problems. Precious metals on the other hand need no special storage or care, aside from perhaps some Tarnex for the silver.

  13. At roughly $520,000 for a (London good delivery) brick of gold, wish I had the problem of having to carry a couple around :)

    I’d agree the basics first, beans, bullets, and band-aids, then bullion. When your preps reach the point that you want to ensure (as much as possible) that you can afford an appendectomy, a replacement tractor, or be able to bribe a government official when the SHTF, then start wondering if you have enough gold. If you can’t afford things like this today, then I wouldn’t worry about gold yet.

    “Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.” – Norm Franz

  14. Rod Zeigler says:

    I look at precious metals (gold, silver, etc.) as the base that all other things (cash, stocks, goods) are compared against. Precious metals have always had value, and always will. The value of the cash, stock, and goods fluctuates, but an ounce of gold will always be an ounce of gold. When it is reported that the price of gold is going up, it means the currency being compared is being devalued.
    I prefer the use of junk silver for transactions between individuals, post apocalypse, due to it’s ease of use and general recognition. Bars of gold are great for large purchases and consolidation of wealth, but are rather unwieldy for most day to day uses. A combination of gold and silver in different forms will guarantee your wealth. Stocks, bonds, cash, and other “paper” that people put value on, with absolutely no intrinsic value, are just items of faith. I prefer not to have faith in those things when the chips are down.

  15. MorePooperThanPrepper says:

    Since 2008 over the years I bought some food, some silver, some ammo, and I had a little gold.

    Food saved me money.
    Ammo is up in value.
    My gold and silver have gone noticeably down. But I have really basked in their intrinsic value when I… I use them – wait I don’t use them, for anything! neither do a single one of any of my neighbors!! they have no intrinsic value. If you think they do then you should use the dictionary and look up intrinsic. They themselves are pretty and shiny and they don’t rust and thats it.

    If you have extra money lying around and you want to buy something with intrinsic value consider body armor.

    When people are starving and getting shot it with food will be worth more than gold.

    • Per Hiero Desteen says:

      MPTP, I’ve been thinking about trying to buy a little silver lately, and your comment on gold not having any intrinsic value kind of stunned me. I consider gold to be better than silver, but I can’t afford it. I’ve tried to look back through history and find a time when gold wasn’t considered money. It was during the Roman, Greek, Persian, and other empires, even the ones mentioned in Biblical times like the Babylonians. Gold, and silver to a smaller degree, have been used as money for centuries in all parts of the world. No matter what happens here in our country, the world is not going to go away, and gold is going to have intrinsic value I believe. I don’t claim to be an expert, but I do know that the key to the future is looking at what happened in the past. That’s why we’re in so much trouble, the PTBs are ignoring history thinking this time they can make communism/socialism work. It won’t.

      And not being disagreeable just curious, but doesn’t body armor have an expiration date of like 5 years? Or is that still under debate?

      • Hi Per Hiero Desteen. I agree: Gold and silver will always have value as jewelry and tableware, as backing for mirrors, and so long as there is an industrial economy both will have some industrial purposes. I think it will likely always have value as coinage, too.

        As I said above: We are the ones who have been living in unusual times for the last 80 years. The advocates of fiat currencies have proven themselves to be as wrong as could possibly be. They do not have the discipline to maintain the value of fiat currency.

        One of the reason that the Federal Reserve was created was to “stabilize the currency”, currency which had been stable for over 120 years.

        Using the fed’s own inflation adjuster, the value of a 1913 dollar is $23.72 in today’s paper money. Funny thing: That is about what a silver dollar goes for these days. Fancy that. So much for stabilizing the dollar.

        Source: Bureau of Labor Statistics inflation adjuster: http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl

        • Oops: should be “as I said below”, not above.

        • MorePooperThanPrepper says:

          I suggested people look up the meaning of intrinsic in the dictionary.

          Intrinsic doesn’t mean “something that has historically been something you could trade with” it means it has value in itself.

          I don’t have to trade with someone to get the value of food, I eat it. I don’t have to trade with someone to get the value out of ammo, I shoot it. I don’t have to trade with someone to get the value of a blanket, I wear it for warmth. What intrinsic value can I get from gold – its shiny, Like PHD says I guess I could make a mirror. It’s only value comes with the agreement from another to swap goods for gold.

          It is no more “intrinsic” than are fiat dollars!

          Is it more “valuable”, is it more “stable”, does it have a better track record than paper currencies? I am perfectly willing to give you that, but it does not have “intrinsic” value it has trade value. It is currency that may or may not be accepted in the future.

          I can get about 2 tons of rice for 1 kruggerand today. That is less than I could get back in 2010, if the balloon goes up and everybody is starving do I expect to get years and years worth of food for a shiny bit of metal? I don’t think so. Why? Because I sure as hell wouldn’t make that trade. Would you?

          If you have a bunch of cash to play with, buy metals, even I did, even though I understood they have no intrinsic value.

          • An interesting point, especially about the intrinsic value. Keep in mind the reason that all those ancient civilizations used gold as a currency and for keeping wealth – it was one of (if not the first, I would need to double check in a book from my university days to be 100% sure) metals ever used for anything. When you find a lump of gold in the ground it is gold, a nugget could be hammered into a plate or a cup if you really wanted it. Copper, Iron and other early history metals required smelting and/or refining to become a usable metal. The use of gold for value predates copper by a few hundred years for this reason – it took people a while to realize that if you build a clay furnace and melt green rocks in it you can get metal out.

            And of course gold was always shiny….

          • I went to dictionary(dot)com and the example for intrinsic was: “the intrinsic value of a gold ring.”.

            It’s value is in it’s rareness, all the gold ever mined throughout history would be a cube of about 25 meters. It has all the qualities that define real “money”, so it’s been used as such for all of recorded history. Currency is not money, and 99% of people today suffer from normalcy bias when it comes to what money is, Federal Reserve Notes are all we’ve ever known, but fiat currencies have ALWAYS failed and our FRNs will be no exception. I agree you can’t eat gold, but think how someone like Selco or FerFal’s stories would have been different if they’d had gold, bribed their way to the front of the line, bought a plane/train ticket, and just left when the SHTF. In many SHTF-scenarios, the best prep to ensure your survival might just be money, and gold has always been money.

            • MorePooperThanPrepper says:

              And, Google’s use-in-a-sentence example is “access to the arts is intrinsic to a high quality of life”. I don’t necessarily find either example a home run.

              I don’t argue that gold isn’t a good money or currency, it just doesn’t have much intrinsic value. If I was trapped alone on an island I would rather have a ton of rice than a ton of gold, because I wouldn’t have anyone to trade my gold with – gold’s value is not intrinsic (it the thing itself), its value comes from its use as a good medium of exchange. Oh, and it also makes good jewelry like rings because of its intrinsic properties (very chemically stable).

              I have a tiny bit of gold. As long as I don’t get in any trouble, I will keep it. Just in case I need to throw it in my pocket and run out the door and leave my entire life behind. It has provided little benefit or value to my life so far. AND, If I wanted to merely store value for future troubled times I would sell my little bit of gold and use the money to buy shotgun shells, 22lr, rice, sugar, salt, and body armor. Even as an insurance it is a luxury, but it is so damn portable. So for now, I keep it.

            • Some of gold’s value is in it’s rarity, silver is more rare than gold but exists at a fractions of it’s intrinsic value. Gold’s intrinsic value is in that it has always been used for currency and trade.

              Agreed though that the dictionary examples are not terribly helpful.

  16. Sadja49 says:

    Some people think that good or mostly junk silver coins will be used as currency. But i believe that the preppers have decided that 22 ammo will be the new trading currency. This is why you can’t find any around very easily. People are hoarding this ammo because of its ability to be useful to a lot of people, it is cheap when you find it, small in size. During the survivalist movement in the late 70’s it was the recommended barter item to buy. I bought 45,000 rounds at 1/2 cent a round and due to circumstances ended up selling it for almost .02 per round. I own some junk silver now and the only gold I have is what I get out of the ground myself. But I continually by 22 ammo.

  17. I don’t think of precious metals as an investment: investments pay dividends, interest, or rent. Stock in a mining company may produce dividends, bonds issued by a mining company should pay interest, and an office building used by a mining company produces rental income.

    Metals themselves do not produce any income, and may well generate costs for safe storage. The price of precious metals fluctuates over time, and those fluctuations can be both downward and huge. Anyone who says otherwise hasn’t looked at the price of gold since 1975. If you bought in 1979 (I did, some) you lost your shirt.

    However, I think there is a very good argument for having some precious metals as part of a balanced approach to allocating resources.

    Four thousand years of history does not guarantee future performance, but four thousand years provides a lot of data: In bad times, people flee to gold and silver as a means of preserving capital.

    It does not matter if that is rational or irrational: What matters is that for thousands of years that has been the case, and we can act rationally based on other people’s predicted behavior, even if we think that behavior is irrational.

    In good times, people trust gold and silver as media of exchange. Remember, we stopped using gold only 80 years ago, and silver only 50 years ago. We are the ones living in a startlingly unusual age, not those before us. History is on the side of gold and silver.

    My inclination is to have some silver, and some gold. Not lots, and certainly I am not going to make any bet so high that buying wrong would be a meaningful financial blow. Nonetheless, silver coins, either junk silver or modern US bullion coins, are a good way to hold silver in readily exchangeable forms. Small ingots made by major mints may also be worth considering, but I think coins are better because they are much more widely recognized as money.

    Another possibility is used silverware, but buying well takes some work. You need a scale, you need to find the stuff, and you usually need cash in your pocket. Sometimes you can get a good deal at estate auctions, but you have to be serious about knowing what you are thinking about bidding on, knowing what it weighs (and what that works out to in silver, not sterling), and let it go if it goes one bid over your limit.

    US gold coins, modern or old, are a store of value, a means of getting some wealth through bad times. (There seem to be a fair number of fake gold bars and some coins out there, though, so one should buy from a long-established dealer with a good reputation, not just Joe Blow at a coin show) There are other means of preserving wealth through bad times, though, including real estate or even stock in good companies.

    My thinking is that there is no one best way, and I can’t predict the future well enough to put all my bets on one thing. I know I can make mistakes, because I have- like buying gold in 1979. That is why balancing our bets against against each other works for us. A small amount of precious metals, some stocks, some bonds, some real estate (our home), sufficient food and other supplies for a fairly extended period, the basic prepper kind of stuff, makes sense to us.

    • Per Hiero Desteen says:

      Wise counsel, sir. Not only a peacemaker, but a well-seasoned advisor on life in general. I feel better about wanting to buy a little silver after reading your comment.

      • Thanks, Per Hiero Desteen. I’ve been making mistakes for a long time. Sometimes I even learn from them.

        My inclination nowadays is to buy a little silver now and then, when what seems like a good opportunity strikes. So far as I know, no one is faking junk silver coins, so they should be pretty safe. So is used silverware, at a price near the melt (bullion) value, especially if you like it enough to use. It won’t wear out.

        Since I don’t buy silver or gold to sell (that is, I am not speculating when I buy it, in the hope of selling it higher), I don’t usually buy when it is high, nor do I sell it then, either. It is a sort of insurance policy which I understand may cost me money if I never need it. I buy it and hold on to it for seriously bad times, meanwhile we get to enjoy using the silverware. That pleasure is a sort of dividend.

        When I think of metals as akin to an insurance policy, whatever I spend is akin to an insurance premium. It is money out of pocket, and just as I hope to never need my fire insurance policy, I hope never to need to sell/trade my precious metals. Insurance only pays off if you suffer a disaster, but then it is really important. Otherwise it is just an expense.

        As part of a balanced portfolio, though, insurance is important, and so are precious metals. The trick is to not go overboard on them. Some is good, lots is probably not so good.

  18. Sorry, I haven’t posted in a while, but I read here every day at least in email. I finally got to a comfortable place with my physical storage last year, debt is almost gone, etc. So I started building up an emergency fund. For the first time ever, I had enough in the bank to get a 1099. When i did my taxes, my return was reduced by the amount of interest I earned… That is when i started buying silver. It will grow and the .gov can go take a hike. I buy 1 to 4 1oz coins every payday. I buy them discretely on Ebay from different vendors, whoever is the cheapest with the highest seller rating at the time. They go in a sealed container in my gun safe. There is plenty of room there since I lost all of my guns in a tragic boating accident…If I ever need to sell them, I will stick them back on Ebay and they should fetch market rate minus the fees.

    • oHIo,
      “I buy them discretely on Ebay “?
      Cash at a local coin shop would be much more discrete and much less trackable.

      • Sorry MD, I fat fingered the “report” button.

        Well, the same fellow coming in once a week to routinely buy a coin isn’t very discreet either. Especially when
        out of them have cameras in the store and parking lot (that will capture your license plate.) There may be a paper trail, but nobody is going to follow it unless there are red flags. Buying them from different vendors keeps you small enough on everyone’s books to not be noticed.

  19. Take my advice on this, prepping WILL take you a long time, and it takes a LONG time to buy silver and gold under the spot price. So perhaps you should start looking at garage sales and flea markets for old coins collection on which you could make “profit” while you invest your real money on prepping.

    That’s what I’m doing. 2 ounces in 6 months for a few dollars. Not a lot, but still good enough for my budget.

    • If you are in it for the long haul, Seamus Finn, think of that 2 ounces in six months as 4 ounces per year X 10 years = 40 ounces. At today’s prices (which may be high or low- we really can’t tell right now) that adds up to roughly US $800.

      That makes a nice stash.

  20. MD thanks for the info sir. I really enjoy reading your articles and especially enjoy reading responses. Keep up the good work my friend that I have never met but none the less consider you to be one

  21. Big Bear says:

    “Money” is what two people in the act of “trading” say it is! Precious metals have value only as long as there is a market, however small, where one of the traders is willing to accept PM’s in trade. All of the comments about “hedging” your bets by having PM’s to trade are spot on ……. for the most part. IMHO, pay heed to them if you believe that at some point in your lifetime (post-SHTF) people will still value gold and silver.

    Historically “salt” was used as a currency by many cultures. It was necessary for life, used as a weapon, and determined the location and development of many towns and ports. During those days gold and silver were used primarily as a way to decorate art. If we are forced into a way of life that is rural and agrarian, the staples we depend upon will once again become more valuable than PM’s.

    MD hit the nail on the head with the first sentence of his comment to Blair: “it depends on the type of collapse, depth and the duration.” The answers to type, depth, and duration is what each of us must decide for our self. Your answers should be a guide for your prepping.

    Personally, I don’t have PM’s in my prepping inventory (other than family Jewelry) because I’d rather spend my money on things that I know will be needed for survival. Can’t eat, shoot, light up the night, or keep warm with PM’s!

    • Big Bear,

      Gold jewelry was used (and probably still is) in after the Argentinean economic collapse – people would cut off lengths of necklaces for example with the length of each cut depending on what was being purchased…

      • Big Bear says:

        In an earlier life I did quite a bit of travelling (for work) to international third world countries. This was back in the 70’s and 80’s. It was very common for people to ask if you wanted to trade your gold or silver for their products or services. I finally asked a vendor about this and he explained that it was important for them to have PM’s that they could carry with them. Then, as now, the value of a gold ring or necklace was great in comparison to their physical size. Portable wealth was important in a country where inflation raged or unrest was a daily issue. In most of the third world countries the instability of their currency could be offset by the relative stability of PM’s. Plus, if they had to bug out to another country, they could easily carry their wealth with them.

      • Per Hiero Desteen says:

        MD, I read somewhere that people in Zimbabwe spend their days looking for specks of gold in streams and rivers. Gold dust is more valuable than their currency, and is used for exchange. Whether that will be the case here remains to be seen, but Zimbabwe had a hyperinflationary spiral, so it could be accurate since that looks like the way we are headed.

  22. TrailGuide says:

    Maybe I’m just an old peep but my wake up call (after the panic) what grounded me was a simple question or maybe it was six regarding it all:
    1) where are we at
    2) where do we want to be
    3) what are our essential needs
    4) are we there yet
    5) what warrants the I ‘don’t even care any more’?
    6) what to do when I’ve covered all of the above

    I’m stuck on the # 4. It becomes are endless cycle of 1-4 that have us constantly evaluating and shoring up the weak spots. Take 10″ of rain that upset some new corn plants (or whatever) presents this week of ‘dang, who would have thought’.
    If we ever get to # 6. I’ll concentrate on precious metals… doubt I’ll ever get there – LOL
    TG – standing by on my wee trail , Very Wet, but on watch
    – In the mean time – there is that missing Malaysian plane – priorities, peeps – Priorities !
    PS – heartfelt prayers for the family of the missing… sometimes we are just part of their plot. Nothing you can do about that except…. well you know …..

  23. GoneWithTheWind says:

    I have invested in both gold and silver and honestly I had so much of it I couldn’t carry it. I can remember taking a friend with me to the bank to get some of it out of the safety deposit box when I wanted to convert it back to dollars when it had gone up in value. There is one important thing to remember about PMs and that is if you buy it at it’s peak or even close to it’s peak you might have to hold onto it for years. I held gold from 1984 to 2006 before I could get my money back and make a little profit. Also gold is problematic for a couple of reasons: 1. It costs $1300 for one ounce and your plan/hope in buying it is that it will go up, maybe double or triple. So what do you do with this gold bullion coin worth $5000? It just isn’t as flexible a PM as silver is. 2. The government can easily make ownership, transporting or trading in gold illegal and they can demand you sell it to them for a price they determine. It has happened before.
    Silver has it’s pro’s and con’s too. If you have a lot of money to invest in PM’s and you buy silver you can easily end up with a couple hundred pounds of it and this has it’s own problems; carrying it when you bug out, hiding it and then trading it in when the time comes. BUT one thing in it’s favor is that it is less likely that the government will make silver illegal. They could! but it’s less likely. Another advantage to silver is since it is worth a lot less per coin vs gold it is more likely that you could use it for barter post SHTF. Today a ounce of silver is worth about $20 and if things go as many think it will it will someday be worth about $50, maybe more. Much easier to trade or turn into cash then gold.

    • Per Hiero Desteen says:

      Doesn’t gold come in denominations as small as 1/10 of an ounce? That would be the only gold that would interest me. I wouldn’t want 1 oz. coins unless I had a lot of money, which I don’t, and needed a safe vehicle to store wealth. I would only be interested in silver, anyway. but gold does have an allure.

      • Keep in mind PHD that the smaller denomination coins or bars you buy the more you pay in minting, shipping, etc.. costs. A 1 oz gold coin costs less than 10 1/10th oz coins. It’s like most things, buying in bulk saves a little more money – provided it fits the budget. Look into the differences before you buy, you might be surprised.

        • Hi CS, that’s a good point. I think of silver as for relatively small transactions, while gold is for big ones. At that point one ounce bullion coins are fine. Still, if I had a chance to buy smaller gold coins for a small enough mark up, I would consider it.

          Many years ago I met a South African woman who told me that her grandparents had escaped from Russia around the time of the revolution. They had sewn gold coins into their leather belts and made their way to South Africa. They didn’t get all of their money out of Russia, but they did get enough to have a good start on a new life.

          Sometimes fleeing your homeland is the least bad option available. That’s when gold and diamonds come in very handy for transporting significant wealth.

          Remember the scene in “Casablanca” where the elderly Jewish couple are selling the wife’s jewelry at Rick’s bar? They didn’t like how much they got, but they at least got something, and they carried it out of their home country on her finger. That ring was the quintessential flight capital, even if they hadn’t thought of it as such when they bought it.

      • PHD,
        Even a 1/10th oz gold coin is a bit of cash, which at this point in time is worth about $130 vs $20 for a full oz of silver.

  24. Bam Bam says:

    I can’t afford gold. But I will buy an silver eagle when I have some extra funds. My goal is to get a role of 20 (eventually). I think back of the Jews during WW2. PMs helped many bribe officials so they could escape. I wouldn’t go overboard with PMs but I think having some on hand might pay for operations, dental visits, repairs, and so on.

    • Per Hiero Desteen says:

      Hey Bam Bam, I also read stories of Vietnamese who bribed officials to get out of So. Vietnam after the communists took control. So yeah, a little gold could come in handy it seems.

    • patientmomma says:

      My grandparents paid their taxes during the great depression by bartering animals, fruits, and veges. Most everyone else lost their property.

      While I can’t afford gold either, I wonder how I will pay property taxes in the future. Will people take the mark of the beast to get food, medicine, shelter? “They” want to control all people, especially, patriots, so will “they” take everything away from us?

      • yes. ‘they’ will. it is well and good to have a property but it is just as vulnerable as any other thing. you think you are as snug as a bug in a rug and then the storm troopers come.
        only God Himself can preserve us.
        do what you can that seems sensible and then rest in Him.
        it’s the only way to have any peace of mind.

  25. Chuck Findlay says:

    I buy at least 5 ounces of silver every week, I have been doing this for years, I keep it home in a safe. I have all my other preps well along the way and I’m not in debt at all so the silver makes sense from my point of view. I buy it locally and pay cash. There is no internet, credit card (I have no credit cards) or any electronic tracks back to my silver. Lately I have been buying more of it since it dropped to $20.00 per ounce.

    • Hi Chuck: “There is no internet, credit card (I have no credit cards) or any electronic tracks back to my silver. ”

      There is now :-)

      I think after accumulating that much silver, I would consider something more compact, like gold. After that maybe even some decent diamonds. 5 oz X 52 weeks = 260 ounces = 16+ pounds. Five years’ accumulation is over 81 pounds: tough to flee with.

      Instead of 260 ounces at c.$20/ounce ($5200) per year, one could buy 4 one ounce gold coins at $1320 for $5280.

      16 pounds vs 4 ounces. Four ounces is definitely flight capital capable. Five years = 20 ounces vs 81 pounds.

      Of course, if fleeing isn’t an acceptable option, it doesn’t matter so much.

      We live on an island: fleeing is always an option we want to maintain.

      • GoneWithTheWind says:

        For what it’s worth I had a lot of silver back in the late 90’s and bought it quite cheap. The price of gold came down at the same time the price of silver went up (not too common an occurrence). So I traded silver for gold (since I didn’t have a lot of cash) and the PM seller gave me a deal so I didn’t pay too much premium to both sell and buy. This is a good thing to keep in mind. Watch the price of PM’s or whatever it is you want to put your money in and when the price difference goes in your favor trade up.

      • Chuck Findlay says:

        There is now :-)

        I wouldn’t put money on that bet.

        First my name is not Chuck, I have no internet connection in my name, no e-mail. I keep my net computer (a used laptop I found on Craig’s list and paid cash for) clear of any important files. I bought a Tablet computer the same way. My main home computer that I keep prepper info on has no wireless card in it so there is no way to look at it without standing in front of it. All file transfers to it is with a USB drive.

        And yea if the government wants you they will find you, but I have to believe I’m not worth the time as I’m a small fry that would gain them little to nothing. And I’m no threat to them, all I want to do is to live my life. I don’t want to overthrow the government. Yea I don’t trust them, but neither does about 200,000,000 other Americans.

        .

      • Chuck Findlay says:

        I converted some silver to gold, but I only have only 2 coins. I don’t have enough money to buy gold outright at any one time. I’m saving up to move out further from the city (an yet still be close to work there) and want to pay for a new place 100% as i will not ever go into debt again. When this time comes I plan on taking it back to the coin store an having them cut me a check. It would be nice if PMs are up when this time comes.

  26. Hunker-Down says:

    I just read through the above 38 posts and find merit in every argument.
    I hope I never have to spend our junk silver (we have no gold) on food, but it may happen. I continue to add to it when we can, which isn’t often enough given the rotting of our country.

    I read a story about a man who bought a bank in Germany after they lost WWII, for one ounce of gold. It took the confluence of loosing a war coupled with hyperinflation for that opportunity to exist, and maybe my stash can be used for a similar opportunity on the other side of TSHTF. I doubt that we could buy a hundred acres with a can of beans, so we have both beans and PM’s.

    Pfunny, no one has defended the dollar in this thread.

    • Chuck Findlay says:

      (Pfunny, no one has defended the dollar in this thread.)

      I don’t know that that could be done with any honesty…

  27. Chuck Findlay says:

    Even during the Argentinean economic collapse people still used PMs to buy things. You could always buy things with PMs. Take a look at FerFal’s U-Tube videos and he talks about the value of PMs in an economic collapse.

    Other then for a very short time when an event first happins there will always be a way to turn PMs into goods, food and the currency of the day.

    The idea that economic trading will just disappear has never been shown to happen in all of human history. People always have and always will trade and gold and silver have been part of that for all of known history.

    Why would you not want to have this option? I know what it is to have very limited resources and to think you can’t buy silver. But we all can buy it even if it’s a few pre-65 quarters, dimes or half-dollars.Even when I was making what most of us here would consider an extremely (as in poverty level income would be a boost of a few thousand $$$) low level of income I still bought a few dimes every week. I don’t buy dimes any more, but I still have them and it’s nice to open the safe and see 20-rolls of them sitting there along with all the other coins and bars. And my local coin shot was always willing to sell me a few dimes as much as they were the guy buying several hundred dollars per visit. With a local coin shop there is no minimum order, just buy what you can.

    .

  28. david h. says:

    As a professional trader, investor and educator I still recommend people hold onto gold. 1. It has intrinsic value, it will always be worth something 2. It will always be a hedge and a means of protecting your wealth in some degree 3. Even if the dollar does collapse it will be useful to barter and trade for goods and services like it has for thousands of years.

    Some of the best gold that I have personally seen grow isn’t just bullion but actually rare gold coins highly sought after by collectors all over the world. These coins that a friend of mine in Europe personally puts together for collections has gone up every year and has never had a down year even though the price of spot gold has and will continue to fall. I personally believe– as a trader that trades everyday–we still have not seen the floor on gold. I’m looking for it to eventually head to $800-$900/ounce.

  29. Oldalaskan says:

    For precious metals (PM) scour yard sales looking for single pieces of flatware. Look for the heavily tarnished ones and rub your thumb on the bottom. If it shines rub the stem and look for 925 or Sterling. A serving spoon is around .75OZT and you could buy that tarnished spoon for a dollar. .75 X .929 = .69675 X $20 = $13.93 approximate melt value of that spoon. While gold is a good place to store your money it will be too large of a denomination for good trade. I would today work for one dollar an hour if you paid me in pre 64 silver coinage. I would recommend ditching all paper money (unless you need TP) and stock pile metal coinage. Reason it’s too hard to mint metal coinage and as a result will have some intrinsic value. When inflation hits you will need some way to break down a silver dollar besides a cold chisel so metal coinage will be necessary. Pre 2010 nickels will have a mineral value as do early pennies. 1944 War Nickels the one with a large mint mark on the back have about 40% silver in them.
    As for .22 ammo, I have noticed the price for a brick of 500 Rds. That I could buy for $10.00 in 1990 today sells for around $25.00. At public auction these bricks go for $100 – $125.00 a brick. The first time it happened to me was last year and I thought “What the Heck are these people bidding on?” but as an auctioneer it’s my job to take your money not stop you from spending it. I also believe ammo not just .22 but all the popular calibers will have trading value so yes buy some silver but buy more ammo. If you need silver you will always find a person with silver to buy ammo. Also be very cautious in selling ammo now that person knows you have silver and will brag about how much or little Silver or ammo you have. Sell firearms ONLY as a last resort. Stocking up on durable goods, food, soap, toothpaste & brushes, candles, matches, seeds these are consumables and will always have a value. To a woman who has been bathing with homemade lye soap a bar of Lux, Ivory or other brand will be a luxury.
    Food will always have a value, eggs, plucked chickens; skinned rabbits (unless the person is a very good friend) don’t sell live animals, fresh vegetables. Why, you will lose your market.
    Skills and knowledge are always something the government cannot take from you and you can barter them. If you are old or crippled with arthritis you can still show (teach) someone how to do something, Farming, gardening, canning, animal raising, plumbing, carpentry, ammo reloading, mechanical skills are a few topics.

  30. Nancy V. says:

    Investing in precious metals like gold and silver is always been advised to protect a financial portfolio in an unstable economy and runaway inflation. Gold is way too expensive for my wallet.

    I believe that in a partial financial collapse, manufacturing would experience shortages of raw metals. So saving rolls of coins, gold and silver jewelry and copper wire is smart.

    But in a total financial collapse, I think that items such as weapons, ammo especially 22LR, medicine, vodka, kerosene, food, water, batteries (solar) and tools would be more valuable.

    • Chuck Findlay says:

      A total financial collapse will not last for a long time. History has proven this over and over. And out of the confusion a new or rebuilt financial system will rise and trade will resume. This is one of the uses of silver and gold. the government can devalue the dollar and replace it with a new one only paying 10% value for the old ones. But silver and gold will still have it’s buying power, it has worked this way for 5000+-years. There is NO reason to think it will not be this way again.

      (weapons, ammo especially 22LR, medicine, vodka, kerosene, food, water, batteries (solar) and tools would be more valuable)

      Only for a short time, then money in whatever form it takes on will be the medium of trade. And how do you get some of that new medium? You exchange some of your silver or gold, that’s how. No one can think of every item to stock up on for bad times, you will at some point need something. To get said item you will need something of value. Take a guess what has been valuable for all of mankind’s history?

      PS: Ammo and firearms are a very poor trade medium as they could be used against you by the person you traded with.

      .

      • Nancy V. says:

        Chuck,

        Sometimes reading other people’s comments can cause you to reexamine your own views. Such is one of the great benefits of reading this blog.

        I think that I may have become myopic, as I have focused so hard on short-term survival needs, that my long-term strategies have become similar.

        I am going to reexamine my views about silver and gold. You are right – total economic collapse will not last forever. Commerce will rebound, and silver and gold will be back in business as a medium of trade.

        Thanks! :)

        • This is why I have the highest respect for folks on this blog–people share information, others reexamine their views in light of new information. This is why I am so honored to be a member of the Pack. We have a community here.

        • Hi Nancy V: “Commerce will rebound, and silver and gold will be back in business as a medium of trade.”

          I think so. Trade continued even after the collapse of the Roman empire. Instead of everyone using Roman coinage, every little ruler issued his own coinage—but coinage continued to be used.

          Long distance trade was somewhat hampered by the need to figure out the relative value of, say, coins issued by the King of Naples changed into the coinage of, say, Hamburg, but that was what money changers did for a living, and trade went on.

          With a universal currency there had been no need for money changers, so that cost of changing money hadn’t existed. That was the argument for Europe going to the Euro: it eliminated the cost of converting currencies in order to do international trade. The Euro has it’s own problems, but that is the fault of being fiat currency, not of being a universal currency.

          I think of the historical beginnings of coinage: The entire world was in a barter economy. When coinage (or at least some standardized medium of exchange) was invented, it became popular almost everywhere.

          There has to be a reason for that rapid spread of the new invention: It facilitated trade. People could sell goods or their labor here, today, and buy something next week, or next year, somewhere else. They could acquire money for their goods or services here, but take that coinage a hundred miles away and trade it for something there.

          That’s a huge advantage over barter.

        • Brearbear says:

          …am i/are YOU…hungry?…eat.
          It costs little to WORK FOR a basic meal!

          …earn/buy/grow/forage/seek/barter/trade…for a basic meal.

          (You…only need three good meals a day)…

          (exept for me..i need a second breakfast…and a second supper)!

          Am i/areyou… thirsty?
          …drink. Water is free…YE…”preppers”!

          …need an expedient fallout shelter?
          …takes some time/tools/skills/materials…PREP FOR IT!

          That goes for anything!…

          (whatever ye feel ye need the most…get it a.s.a.p.)!

          Focus on the basics…build up then..oneday buy some “gold”.

          Need shelter prepper?…GOD…has provided ye with many sources to build…at little cost just time.
          Need clothing?…humbly keep thy body warm…dry…and.clean!

          (think light weight backpacking…).
          …it takes MINIMALISM…to be free friends.

          Ye do not NEED that MUCH to live a long…HAPPY…and HEALTHY life.

          Think simplicity.

          And remember life can be short.

          …i…humbly…

          …would rather have a crapload of preps…with a a lot of it cached/hidden…

          *Example:(1-mountain house pack/which is one meal… has a longevity of 5years…

          …a#10 coffee can same brand20-25 years)…

          …than…

          Some gold.

          (I can eat the freeze dried food)!

          Put some treasure away…but keep prepping the stuff you really need. Food/water…etc.

          And…KEEP ON LEARNING SKILLS FIRST…before wealth.

          *ok.
          O.k.
          YES I WOuld Luv to have abillion tons of gold hidden also. (at least i am being truthfull)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
          !!!

      • Rider of Rohan says:

        “PS: Ammo and firearms are a very poor trade medium as they could be used against you by the person you traded with.”

        There’s a lot of wise counsel on this thread. Something else I hadn’t really thought about enough. I would definitely be more willing to trade a silver coin with a stranger than a box of .22lr.

  31. Chuck Findlay says:

    A very good book on investing (with or without a lot of money) is “The Alpha Strategy” by John Pugsley.

    You can start investing with as little as $20.00.

    The book is broken up into 2 parts.

    The first part explains about all the ways people reach into your wallet and extract your money, most times without you even knowing it. Kinda boring, but you need to read it to really understand what he’s telling you in the second part.

    The second part is about investing in a way that once you invest the money, it can never be dipped into by others again.

    It explains what real wealth is and is not. Most investors get this wrong. It will likely change (awaken common sense) the way you look at investing.

    The book is almost written for the prepper kind of person.

    And the good news is that since it came out in the 1980s it’s now a free download, just search for it and download it. I downloaded it years ago and then bought a paper copy of Amazon for $4.00.

    Don’t let the free download or low price fool you, this book is full of good info.

    .

  32. Texanadian says:

    I think it was Warren Buffet who said – and I paraphrase,
    Gold will not make you rich but it will protect your riches. He went on to say that in 1970 (?) an ounce of gold would buy a nice suit, shirt and tie. Today at about $1200/ounce an ounce of gold will buy you a nice suit, shirt and a tie.

    This has always stuck with me.

  33. I am reminded that during times of crisis, the value of the trading item depends on how bad the two parties want to trade, currently on the street, drug addicts trade stolen items for drugs, and the do very badly in the exchange, as anyone would have guessed. When the crack epidemic was huge, the exchange broke down to one stolen object, one rock of crack, regardless of what the object was, since the addict was so addicted, their need was so great.
    All of that said, there are a lot of trade items that people may want, precious metals, are not limited to gold and silver, copper is valuable now and will be after teotwawki, lead and tin.
    I remember asking employees of a woodworking store, if Shtf, what would you “take from the store”, and the consensus was sharpening stones, since everything else would be useless if not sharp.
    I would say that anything you think is important, that you have extra of may be a future bartering currency, it could be can goods, it could be can openers. Time will tell.

  34. We consider gold and silver a wise investment.
    At the present time you have Russia purchasing oil from Iran with their currency, then reselling it on the open market which is US dollars. Guess who could dump those dollars back into the US??!! We know that our illustrious government will not send that extra paper to the furnace to be destroyed. Paper is paper without a pm to back up its value. We lost that when we were taken off the gold standard.

  35. Nemoseto says:

    I’m reminded of an episode of the twilight zone where a couple guys rob a bank and hide a truck load of gold in a cave with cryogenic tubes and freeze themselves till the statue of limitations is up. they then kill each other over it when they wake up and the last guy to survive gets to town and finds out gold is worthless and people just throw it in the trash.

    invest in something more worthwhile, gold prices are more stable over a long time than other money since its a relatively rare metal and sought after by a lot of people. its not something you can use as money in shtf, its more a long term investment that pays out if things don’t collapse.

    • MorePooperThanPrepper says:

      Yeah I was thinking of that twilight zone today too.

      I have some metals for three reasons:

      1) to give them to my kids to hold on to and remember me by decades from now.
      2) in case, someday, I have to run out the door to save my families life, I can grab some stuff and some of it will be metals (this is not a plan for survival it is an act of desperation).
      3) its trade value will probably not go to absolute zero the way some other investments might. In the next few decades might it be only worth half of what it is now? yep maybe. In a true SHTF situation might I only be able to get 1/10th or 1/100th the food and ammo I can get for its cost today? I think that is a distinct possibility. But it will probably retain some purchasing power.

      Speaking of ironic gold stories, do you know why you hear so many successful stories of gold bribery to get out of Nazi Germany? The dishonorable-Nazi’s victims never get to tell their stories of how bribing officials with gold can be tragically unsuccessful.

    • Nemoseto,
      I was thinking of that same episode. It was BTW worthless because they had learned how to make it from scratch.

  36. Texanadian says:

    Makes a great tooth cap, Juz azz the boyz in da hood. :)

    • Chuck Findlay says:

      I use to wonder how much money in gold Mt T use to have in all those chains he had around his neck?

  37. Texanadian says:

    So you are sitting in BOL and are well stocked with everything. Someone shows up and offers you a handful of gold coins for a weeks supply of food. You do not feel threatened and can tell the gold is real. Would you make the trade?

    • Assuming that we were indeed well stocked, I can’t think of any reason not to consider the trade. We would be exchanging something which we have in surplus for something of greater value to us.

      I think one has to think of the concept of marginal value. If I absolutely have to have a year’s worth of food, and I have only 40 weeks of food, the value of the 40th week’s worth of food is very high to me. There are almost no conditions under which I would dispose of a week’s worth, because I don’t think I have enough as it is.

      If I actually have 5 years’ worth stashed, and believe I only need 1 year’s worth, the value of the 5th year worth of food is far lower to me than the first year’s. I have to have one year, two years is darn nice, 3 years, 4 years, 5 years…to me that would be trading stock at the right price. As my stock is reduced, the value to me of what remains goes up

      But think of the guy who has 300 ounces of gold, a family to feed, and no food. The value of the first several weeks’ worth of food is far higher to that guy than my fifth year of food is to me.

      I think we would do a deal, because each of us would come out ahead.

      And it would take some pressure off the other guy to rob and maybe murder us. There is value to that, too.

    • MorePooperThanPrepper says:

      How about this one Texanadian and Penrod, It is April of 2014, you are a well off suburbanite and you just got a tax refund check for $3,000. You have the distinct felling that something is not right with the economy so a friend tells you he’ll sell you his handful of gold coins for $3,000. Was that a great trade for the coming SHTF?

      • Hi MPTP: “Was that a great trade for the coming SHTF?”

        I don’t know. If the coins total at least 2.27 ounces of gold ($3000 at todays prices, plus a very small mark up) it might be an OK trade. Not a great trade because I could have gotten that good a deal from any dealer. (I am assuming the coins have no numismatic value, but they might be worth many times their gold bullion value: that matters a lot)

        If instead they totalled 3 ounces I would probably do the deal because I would be getting $950 worth of gold more than I paid for.

        Even then, though, I would have to think about whether some or all of that money might be put to better use. I could buy the 3 ounces for $3000, then sell two ounces for $2600, which would leave me an ounce worth $1300 for only $400.

        That sounds like a pretty great deal, if I am satisfied that my more immediate preps -water, food, ammo, meds, whatever- are satisfactory or could be made satisfactory by spending the $2600 I got for the other two ounces.

        So my answer to your question is : That depends.

    • Texanadian,
      It would depend on the long term lookout. If the chickens werelaying regularly, and the garden was looking good, bees a buzzing, etc. then it would make a good trade. If my future production was not up and running or was running poorly, then maybe not such a good thing. It might also depend on what the weeks worth of food needed to be. Beans & rice with a little oil & sugar or honey, vs. stores of stable meat, might also make a difference.

  38. Chuck Findlay says:

    I preped for 3-years before I bought any silver. It was a time of very low income and I was convinced I didn’t have any money for silver. I learned to shop wisely and slowly built up your normal prepper supplies. But I wish I did buy even silver dimes back then, I would have a lot more of it now. I could have cut out restaurant eating, or any one of a few other areas. I also have always made things and sold them. These windfalls should have been put into silver. I do this with them now and usually buy a 10-ounce bar with the extra income.

    .

  39. A few bricks of gold? More like a few 1/10th oz coins, rounds, or bars. A IMHO silver is a better buy and a more useful post SHFT resource; however, I agree with MD’s assesment that you should have all of your other preps in order first, starting with a good supply of water or filtration equipment and a years wirth of staple stable food.

    • Brearbear says:

      Make that a 20 year’s…
      Supply my friend…

      :)

      Think BIG!

      • Brearbear,
        Actually a 2-year supply would be reasonable; however, no matter the size of the supply, it should be in place to sustain you and yours until you have your own food production up and running, hopefully within 12-18 months. Just planning on living on stored food is eventually a losing game.

        • Brearbear says:

          OhioPrepper

          1. “A 2-year supply would be reasonable”

          That kind sir…is your opinion.

          My humble opinion and personal goal is to have many years worth of all preps stocked up.
          It is not that hard to have a five year supply…i would like to have ten or more…

          I use my preps daily…cycling through them.

          2. “It should be in place to sustain you and yours until you have your own food production up and running”.

          Yes. IF IT IS POSSIBLE. But…have a plan “B”.

          In case it is dangerous or some how not possible to have your own food production. Or maybe you can only…grow/raise “some” food but only to supplement your stocks…

          You may have to be on foot/living in secrecy-hiding…living from cache to cache…you may not have a place to farm. There may not be much for wildlife. (the great depression era supposedlly almost knocked out most wildlife)…

          There may be ongoing environmental/war issues to deal with…

          3. “Just planning on living on stored food is eventually a losing game.”

          Yes…”plan” on food production growing/raising food…(have seeds etc)…
          …and on trapping/hunting/fishing/foraging…
          But in my opinion having many years of food is essential….
          …also can be used for bartering and trade.

          Plus…i most likely will have other mouths to feed.

          There are so many possible issues to deal with…and in order to TRY and cover everything…
          I sure would not want to only have a mere 2 years worth of food.
          WW1 and 2…AND the Great depression were ALL MUCH LONGER than 2 years.

          In this day and age…where one can get for ex: a small serving food packet for around $10.00
          (Canadian)…with a longevity of 5years…

          And with food safe buckets/mylar bags/oxygen absorbers/gama lids…

          Building a very large stockpile of long term food and preps is possible.

          Like i said…THINK BIG…in my humble opinion.

          …just in case.

          …and like i said in my above comment…

          “…would rather have a crapload of preps…with a a lot of it cached/hidden…”

          AND…

          “Put some treasure away…” (gold/silver etc.).

          “but keep prepping the stuff you really need. Food/water…etc.”

          Just my take on things…

  40. Tactical G-Ma says:

    My 2 cents:
    To prep with only food is foolish. As is prepping with only meds, fuel, gold, silver, or any other goods or service. The more diverse one is the better unless you have a crystal ball that works.

    Maybe rich soil will become negotiable (Waterworld). I can’t afford to put tons of cash into PMs but DH and I do manage a little here and there. And we manage to put back the other preps. All the things that keep you alive will be of value to everyone else.
    Food, shelter, security, medicine, clothing, transportation, and luxuries. And only after all these needs are met will the PMs or Jewels have any value.
    So, I think if you have all the bases covered you should have both gold and silver. Since gold is less portable and in many cases may not be negotiable (unless a loaf of bread costs $130), pocket change in silver or gold chain or rings must also be considered.

    • TGM,

      I was issued a crystal ball when I became an NCO in the military because I was expected to know what was going on with my people everywhere at all times. I was held accountable for it to.

      They made me turn it in when I got out. I don’t know if that’s a good thing or not.

      • Tactical G-Ma says:

        Sirius
        We always said to make E-7 you had to have a gut on which to balance the coffee cup, to make E-8 a vasectomy was needed, and E-9 required a prefrontal labotomy. My DH always insisted he ranked higher than any Admiral aa an E-9!

  41. Brearbear says:

    If…

    Rationing/budgeting…

    365 days… (1year)…
    x 3 (meals per day…not including “snacks”)…
    = 1095 meals for one person for one year…

    (now…ALL the “other” preps need to be included)…
    The biggest one being water.

    Correct me if i am wrong…but the golden number of meals is 1095/approx.

    1095 meals…(1year food…)…times
    5years = 5475 meals for a 5year supply for one person…(lets say a healthy adult…as children an babies have not just less consumption…but different needs). And of course some people (me)…eat more than others…”second supper…second breakfast”…and there are variables on what a “starvation” ration is versus…an average days consumption needs…as per individual…(also…some people have health needs)…

    So.

    Thats approx. 5475 meals…plus water/and other preps needed to have a “basic” hopefully healthy
    Life…five years worth… !!!

    I would rather have 5475 meals put away…plus daily preps…(of course water is not just vital…but extremely hard to put away such a large amount unless you have land…and invested in huge water containers). (but ye are ALWAYS to be water stocking/working on it daily anyway…right prepper)?

    THE BIGGEST “possible”CHALLENGE…water.
    (not even including…freezing of water issues).

    1095/meals…1year…one person
    5475/meals…5year…one person.

    Gives us a perspective…something to go by.
    (and that is only for ONE person…

    IF…planning for more than one person…ye need that much more!

    Here is an example:
    (there are many other companies to research…this is but 1. )…
    (i have/use/…and like Mountain House…want to try others).

    “Your Price$1,499.99″

    9687 Total Servings 1 Person 1 Year Food Storage:

    http://www.costco.com/9687-Total-Servings-1-Person-1-Year-Food-Storage.product.100003177.html?MobileOptOut=1&MobileOptOut=1

    (a”serving” for me…may be more/less than for you…but you get the jiff)?

    Only 5475 MEALS is 5 years food…approximately.

    5475 meals…

    And it WILL help keep me alive for a time?

    Why not strive to have much stocks/preps? (ye can help others who have prepared not…
    And can help those whom cannot prepare).

    So yes…20 year supply…

    SI VIS PACEM PARABELLUM

    “If you want peace…prepare for war”.

    “Be Prepared…”

    Boy Scout Motto

    *ALWAYS and daily…

    KEEPING ON WORKING ON…
    GATHERING THY PREPS!…think BIG…and also get some gold/silver.

    What is YOUR S.H.T.F. Diet?